How BC Anarchists/Terrorists Won Control

Make no mistake about it: in BC, the anarchists and terrorists are taking control.

It’s NOT the majority who now decide; it’s not the elected who now rule; it’s not the law that now governs YOUR life.

It’s those who were not elected, not designated by any majority, and who couldn’t care less about any laws, police demands to move on or even Court decisions and orders to cease and desist who now decide what spaces they will seize or leave free, what services they will disrupt or allow to proceed and even whether and where YOU will be able to work, shop or even move around as a free citizen. Or not,

Isn’t that ironic!  Agitators, anarchists and even terrorists, many of whom have rarely worked steadily  … because they can’t or won’t …  now living on welfare and every other kind of handout of public funds they can muster ….…  dare to BAR those who do work and pay taxes to help fund their welfare payments.

And then there are the so-called First Nation elders or ” hereditary leaders” who some blame for doing little or nothing to get their peoples investments and jobs to wean them off welfare … and thus contributed to the appalling conditions and poverty that has plagued their communities: and yet, they still try to obstruct job/revenue creating projects.

It’s time to get real.

First of all … First Nations are NOT the only community to have respected “elders” or hereditary leaders: EVERY racial, ethnic, religious, residential or business community that makes up this great land has its respected elders … those who have gone before, broken new ground, sacrificed to advance the progress, education, growth and the financial success of succeeding generations … and all their relations.

These elders did not make sit on their laurels as unemployment, ignorance, poverty, dependence on hand-outs and family abuse ran rampant in their communities … or as opportunity and the rest of society passed them by.

Certainly, my respected elders thankfully NEVER opposed investments, jobs and projects that enabled me or our community to succeed, to work, to achieve a better life … for us, and our neighbours.

How did BC get to the point where ANYONE unelected, holding no office, can gain control … advocating a position that would keep their own people in poverty and on perpetual social assistance … and THEY get to control the conversation and the agenda ?

While their “supporters” … many from the rent-an-agitator casting department … can disrupt an entire society …. without any real consequence?

How?

Because WE … and I include myself to some extent … have elected spineless “representatives” at every level of government: we wanted government that cares for/responds to the majority, the people, the middle class; but got instead weak-kneed enablers whose weak responses, even in the face of illegal acts, massive societal disruptions  and violence, have FAILED our society … and let the anarchists win.

In fact, the inept, ineffective and incompetent responses of our own “leaders” has actually encouraged the protestors, activists, terrorists to escalate their demands, actions and disrespect for the majority … and any laws.

BC has been descending into this anarchy for some time.

Take a look at how long at Oppenheimer Park … an entire neighbourhood has been robbed of its only major local park, now floundering in filth … while out elected officials do almost NOTHING!  And no one dares even ask those who are there where they are from and why the people of Vancouver should provide them free housing?

And remember the “420” fiasco where a large seaside park was almost destroyed  … with damages costing  thousands of dollars to remediate … and yet, the organizers got away with much of it? Our do-nothing politicians failed us.

Just look at our universities, where free speech can be inhibited and students intimidated or even attacked for expressing/supporting policies/politicians/countries the activist/agitator class oppose. Free speech and democracy died on campuses years ago.

And WHY do the police do almost nothing when un-elected mobs of fascists disrupt public roads, bridges, services, offices?

Why?

Look at Vancouver City Council; look at the Vancouver Parks Board; look at the BC government.

There is NO leadership standing up for … or enforcing the law anymore,  or protecting the majority!  Lip service to our laws … but no real ACTION to enforce them or punish those who violate them..

Our elected bodies have all, in my view, by their feeble reactions catered to, licenced, helped and even encouraged the illegal acts and the massive disruptions of public services and facilities.

Those who repeatedly ignore and break the laws to disrupt society should be IMPRISONED … not just arrested, served with paperwork, processed and then released with useless “suspended” sentences  … to continue their insurrection.

And Court orders and injunctions sought by paper tiger politicians and waved in the air by powerless police mean NOTHING to them.

We have allowed the fascist bullies to take over…. or at least our “leaders” have.

The anarchists now decide what society can do … not our elected bodies; they will rule … or destroy if challenged; and, they will get away with it … because too many of our elected officials fear … or support …. them, more than they fear … or support … us.

Harv Oberfeld

You can hear me discuss this Blog topic further on the following HoweStreet.Com Podcast: https://www.howestreet.com/2020/02/harvey-oberfeld-canada-being-ruled-by-unelected-anarchists/

(Reminder: You can get free First Alerts to all new postings on this blog by following @harveyoberfeld on Twitter. No spam…just Alerts to new blog topics.)

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59 Responses to How BC Anarchists/Terrorists Won Control

  1. 13 says:

    Welcome back Harvey.
    Your essay is very much on point. It would be hard to argue with any of your comments
    Out for brunch yesterday with 3 other couples. There was much discussion and disgust about the same concerns you have outlined.
    I asked the group if we all had a concern that we could protest over. All agreed we pay to much tax to all 3 levels of government. I suggested we follow the example of our indigenous brothers and sisters.
    Keep your eye out for a group of aging white guys blockading a public roadway soon. I wonder if we will get police protection from irate commuters

    (Response: I’d bet YOU would be arrested within the hour of not moving aside when told to do so. And so would your elderly parents, if they were with you. h.o)

  2. 13 says:

    BTW Harvey your current essay should be published on every oped page in every news paper across Canada. Furthermore every news anchor should be f/orced to learn how to read and lead off the news at 6pm reciting your current essay. Then they can carry on with dog/cat/bird/goat /and last night a hippopotamus story
    God help us all

  3. Gordie says:

    You seem to know a lot about these people. Let’s see…they are on welfare, they are terrorists(?), anarchists, fascists, they rarely work. Where did you get all this inside information? From sitting on the deck of a cruise ship, talking to Americans?,

    (Response: LOL! Very good … gave me a laugh. But No …I gained my expertise from watching the same old protestors and “spokespersons” for decades (I know several by name) showing up at almost any and every dispute, demonstration, disruption … personally always marvelling at their abilities to get breaks from their school classes or time off work (LOL) … sometimes for days at a time (more LOL), travelling far and wide for causes, any causes, to disrupt those who do work…. and pay taxes to support the anarchists … with welfare. h.o)

  4. Harry Lawson says:

    Harvey,

    Welcome back, hope you are rested and well.

    you left out the lack of action from our prime minister . Canada is on the verge of a crippling escalation of this highly organized attack of uncivilized disobedience . i call this uncivilized disobedience because a legitimate issue has been hijacked by the anarchist and economic terrorist .

    So where is our prime minister ?

    Our prime minister is flying around trying to get a seat on the security council , pandering to dictators , while Canada is in crisis.

    (Response: I did consider the role …or lack thereof … of the federal government and Trudeau. However my main focus/concern right now is the chaos being allowed to run amok in Vancouver and BC … even being assisted and encouraged by our too many of our local municipal and provincial elected officials … too weak or afraid to let the police move in immediately when protest descends into anarchy. h.o.)

  5. DonGar says:

    Welcome back. Vacation seems to sharpen your writing.

    And to your point when we have politicians like May and a mayor like Stewart (also police board chair) who are proudly arrested for breaking the law (Kinder Morgan) are they not setting example that the laws need not be respected if you do not agree with them?

    (Response: There are times when people of conscience can …and should … disobey laws: eg Wars they cannot support or opposing persecution/deportations under evil regimes anywhere or the Holocaust. But those who did that in times of real danger (like Erik Bonhoffer) were willing to pay the price: not just pose for pictures, and grant interviews before being escorted away…. knowing full well nothing will really happen to them. So now they know they can disrupt our entire society … and get away with the anarchy they cause. SHAME on the politicians who fail to do their jobs of protecting our communities … or worse, encourage and validate the lawbreakers. h.o.)

  6. Art Smith says:

    Hi Harvey, welcome back.
    Nature it is said “abhors a vacuum”, and so after too many years of weak and ineffectual politicians, the vacuum is being filled. The bought and paid for protesters, the nut-jobs, the woefully naive, and people with nothing better to do, have all decided or have been conned into shutting down, what used to be a wonderful place to live for most of the population. And they are getting away with it because of those weak and ineffectual so called leaders.
    One ceremonial PM is off traipsing around Africa, trying to get all kinds of dictators to help him get a useless job with the equally useless and corrupt UN.
    Our provincial government sending an official to help organize the pipeline blockade, and a minister, George Heyman (sp) to give $400,000 to them.
    Our less than useless police forces of all stripes, refusing to do their jobs, and aiding and abetting the protesters.
    All of them, doing nothing but collecting pay cheques and bleating out platitudes about how we are a country of laws.
    Yes, laws for Joe Average citizen who tries to move a blockade, so he can get to work. He gets arrested jig time.

    (Response: This could end up being the NDP’s Achilles Heel. The middle class are getting fed up with working harder and harder, but getting little or not at all ahead … as all kinds of taxes and fees rise, while at the same rime they see the Mayor, Vancouver City Council, Parks Board and BC government pandering to those who contribute little or nothing …but constantly demand more and more attention and funding … and, in the case of the protestor mob and anarchists, even control over society’s investments, developments, major projects.. It’s appalling and absurd … and hopefully the working people are getting mad as hell and are not going to take it anymore. h.o.)

  7. Harry Lawson says:

    Harvey,

    The B C NDP has a small minority in the house the reality is tuesday is budget day soon after a vote of confidence will happen . there is always a chance that we could see the goverment lose the vote and we go to the polls. then what will MR Horgan do? i am sure that the that the 2000 election results when the NDP lost 39 seats and elected 2 seats must be a concern .anarchist may block the public, however the public votes the public is getting angry at all

  8. 13 says:

    Gordie? Exactly who why where do you think these protesters are? I tend to agree 100% with HOs experience and logic . Other political pundits agree with HOs description as do many of the politicans.
    Ill check with my employer tomorrow if I can take a few weeks off to try to bring Canadas economy to a halt.

  9. Jim A says:

    Awesome article. Accurately points out the truth. I agree with every point you made. Thank you
    I sent emails earlier to my MP Kerry-Lynn Finlay and also to
    Marc Miller Minister of Indigenous Affairs to point out Criminal Code Section 423 covering Intimidation

    All blockaders need to be arrested and charged. And I am also getting really tired of these announcements about “unceeded territory” It’s Canadian land not Indian land. I am getting tired of the relentless First Nation victim mentality. You addressed that part very well.

    (Response: British Columbians and Canadians are compassionate people … but we don’t believe unelected radical activists, agitators, law-breakers and even terrorists should be able to cajole and blackmail … or even be encouraged by our elected officials. h.o.)

  10. beanniez says:

    Not only BC. Trudeau says the rail blockades are a police issue. Bull shit. If it was the police would be thrilled to arrest these troubled people.

  11. Barry says:

    Harve: If you know that some of these protesters are on welfare, then it is your duty to report them. While on welfare, they are supposed to be actively looking for work. If you don’t, then in my opinion you are contributing to fraud.

    On a related topic, Trudeau spent much of the last 2 weeks on a “please vote me” tour of Africa to get on the UN security council. Nice to see when a national emergency comes long, he has his priorities straight. Having just seen a retrospective of the FLQ crisis, I can’t help but wonder what his dad would have done in his place?

    (Response: It’s the naivety and denial you are displaying re the large number of welfare-financed protestors/agitators that has created the terrible disruptive chaos our society faces so often today. h.o)

  12. e.a.f. says:

    There are several issues at play in this essay. They’re all different.
    The Oppenheimer Park “settlement”, is a drug invested play ground for drug dealers and their customers. They need to go. The Parks Board’s “decision” to want to use an Indigenous process to arrive at a solution is out of wack. All I see are drug dealers and addicts. The Park’s board has another agenda, in my opinion, and it doesn’t have much to do with parks or finding people places to live. When it comes to rights, those who used to use the park, have rights also and they’re being ignored. They may invoke terror in some but they’re not terrorists in the true sense of the word. They may create anarchy, but they’re not anachists, which is a political philosophy/agenda. They’re just drug dealers. Move them along, remediate the park and let the people who live in the area use the benches once again, play baseball, etc.

    (Response: There is a common link between Oppenheimer Park and the closing of the Thousand Island Bridge etc. … there is no rule of law. Thanks to our current crop of spineless politicians, there are no consequences anymore for those who take over and deny others use of facilities. The rights of the majority no longer count … the anarchists can do almost anything … and they know, despite all the machinations and Court papers and procedures, in the long run nothing of any consequence will happen to them. In fact, things are getting to the point, with the leaders we now have, they could even get their way! h.o.)

  13. e.a.f. says:

    I’d like to get on to the subject of the “so called First Nations elders or ‘hereditary leaders’ and the rest of the paragraph. Its like your white privilege is showing Harvey. The Supreme Court decision is clear, there are Hereditary Chiefs and they do have “say” over the unsceded territory. The elected chiefs and councillors were the creation of the European style government based in Ottawa. It was in their “image” that these government systems were created and it was for their convience, not for those who were to labour with in that system. The governance by the elected Chiefs and councillors is restricted to the Reserve.
    ‘weaning them off welfare” omg don’t know how you came to write that. The Indigenous People are not babies who need to be weaned. They are adults who live in areas where employment is not abundant and employers have not been willing to hire Indigenous People either. What you are suggesting is they destroy their land to benefit foreign owned companies and countries. The pipe line may be owned by the Canadian government but the oil/gas whatever goes through these pipe lines will be foreign owned. the oil/gas will be exported to foreign countries who will in turn use it to pollute the atmosphere. There will be spills on our oceans which destroy them. Some people just aren’t that keen on it. Some elected Indigenous Chiefs are in favour of the pipelines because they see money. But who really in the end gets what.

    That pipe line is going to cost over $12 billion to build. With declining prices and use, why would we even want to subsidize this with our tax dollars. We bought the pipe line and that is fine, now close it.

    When you write of “weaning them off welfare” I first thought you meant the oil/gas industry and a few other resource companies. We, the taxpayers of Canada, subsidize these corporations, to the tune of $2.3 billion to $4.3 billion a year. (take your pick) It has to stop. If corporations can’t make it on their own, let them find something else to do.

    AS to your comparison of Indigenous elders and your elders, in my opinion it all smacks of racism. We of European descent had a leg up from the get go in this country. Inuit were not permitted to vote until 1950 and then ballot boxes were not sent to their communities so they could actually vote until 1962. Our immigrant parents were voting way before that.

    In my opinion we ought not to take our “white privilege’ attitudes into this discussion. Diane Francis went so far as to write about the “privileged” who were demonstrating. Didn’t know it was a privilege for Indigenous people to protest/demonstrate. I did it a fair amount in my younger days and always considered it my right and/or obligation.

    Yes, people are protesting on rail lines, on bridges, roads, etc. Why not? It may be inconvient for you and some others but so is having mercury in your water, and after all these decades it still hasn’t been cleaned up in Grassy Narrows. Now if Diane Francis believes Indigenous people are so “privileged” I suggest she go live in Grassy Narrows for a while and drink the water while she’s at it. See how privileged she feels then.

    Having watched some of the reporting I get the impression some of the MSM would like nothing better than to move the RCMP and military into these areas where protests are going on and if a few Indigenous People get killed so much the better. More events to cover and their corporate friends can get back to raking in the bucks.

    Currently governments are taking it slow and steady and not doing anything stupid. We talk, and then talk some more. if every one is so concerned, why not just move the pipeline to an area which does not fall with in the Unceded Territory of the Indigenous People. Its so easy, so simple, just move the pipe line. Why not? Is it going to cost some money, which corporate Canada doesn’t want to spend Well to some Indigenous People that land, is money. Its how they feed themselves. Its their future.

    (Response: Yes, the Supreme Court was clear: it did NOT give hereditary chiefs or even elected band members VETO powers over properly exercised elected government or legitimate and legal corporate decisions. But that’s not the problem with what has been happening: it’s the theft of the entire agenda by anarchists, who really couldn’t care less about the First Nations, their poverty, their economic future. What the anarchists want is to screw our society … in any and every way they can and achieve blackmail POWER. Sadly our weak “leaders” .. most of them on the political left … and out almost powerless police and useless Courts … are not just letting them get away with it… but through their weak responses, encouraging them to disrupt our society even more. h.o)

  14. e.a.f. says:

    This is not an insurrection. This is people protesting. Now it maybe people just don’t like Indigenous People protesting. they’re to accept their fate as we the “white” community decides it must be.

    This protest started in B.C. but others have joined in all across the country. Some thing is driving this and it may just be Indigenous people have had enough of their “lot in life”. they may want a share of the pie. the reporting and carrying on about these protests may have little to do with the current pipe line, but rather should Indigenous people make advancements in their negotiations regarding this pipe line will they be emboldened to stop the Teck tar mine in northern Alberta? Will they say no to other “developments” by corporations for the benefit of foreign countries? Some with in corporate Canada may not want an Indigenous community which fights back.

    Last night’s 11 p.m. news on global could leave you thinking our economy was going to go down the toilet, gas rationing was coming and there would be shortages. Lets get a grip. The reporter was waxing on about the 40- waiting freighters in the harbour. That is not an emergency or anything unusual. I’ve counted that many over the years at any given time. O.K. let me correct that. I have counted as many as 38 of them in Vancouver Harbour in the previous two decades, at any given time, and another 5 to 10 off of Vancouver Island. No strike, no protests, nothing different.

    Couldn’t stop laughing when the reporters talked about gas shortages or tape on the gas pumps. That would be rich. We produce the stuff but we don’t refine it, it goes out of the country .

    The non Indigenous community may be inconvenienced by these protests but we need to get over ourselves and our privilege. there are others out there who have had little to say about how the world impacts their lives and they may just have had enough.

    I’m with the protestors on this one. I also have a 3 month supply of coffee in the kitchen and creamo in the freezer. O.K. so I’m privileged I have the stuff.

    (Response: There’s a BIG difference between having a protest and the disruption/intimidation/damage to innocent people just trying to get to work or pursue their own lives. Protests are peaceful activities carried out at or outside the place(s) of disputed actions or at the offices/locations of those responsible for the project or policies. I support that right. BUT when anarchists USE protest as a pretext to deny other citizens’ THEIR rights and activities … especially people who have absolutely nothing to do with anything related to the dispute … even hundreds or thousands of miles away … then the perpetrators have become bullies, blackmailers … just plain anarchists … and should be arrested and imprisoned and forced to pay damages … and if there is damage of any kind to facilities, they are terrorists and should be treated as such. Not to mention the damage they do to democracy … as people around the world watch these anarchists get away with their antics. h.o.)

  15. Leila Paul says:

    It would appear, eaf, that you have a problem with the parliamentary representative government we have, in principle if not now in practice. Our democratic institutions are under threat and being eroded by what Harvey correctly identifies as anarchists.

    Our system of government, when it’s permitted to operate without anarchic interference, is not entirely a European creation. Our parliamentary democracy is, in fact, based on the concept that elected leaders represent the people who elected them.

    Thugs and mobs do not have the right to deny others their rights. One’s rights are sacrosanct, but they do stop at the edge of imposing their unelected will where they trample, dominate, or obviate the rights of others through intimidation.

    That is anarchy and it never ends well.

    What you attribute to a European style government was not the norm when people migrated away from European aristocracy and its hereditary powers that deprived people (regardless of their skin colour) opportunities to live peacefully. What they were seeking might loosely be termed a “democracy” and not one based on hereditary powers as in the days when underlings were either obedient to the “hereditary” elders or hereditary elites or they’d suffer tremendously for daring to think they should have a say in how their lives were affected.

    When migrants began to flee to the shores of the “new world” they were seeking what might be described as freedom to pursue organized societies that respected certain rules of conduct. Remember these notions as we attempted to eradicate hereditary classes and HEREDITARY PRIVILEGES:

    “Peace, order and good government” are the words used in section 91 of the British North America Act of 1867 (now Constitution Act, 1867) to define the Canadian Parliament’s lawmaking authority….

    You can use meaningless terms that have become memes, like “white privilege” and “indigenous” when neither of those is based on genetic reality any longer.

    In fact, indigenous peoples did not have to SELF-SEGREGATE. They could have integrated and enjoyed the economic prosperity and social mobility of many of the first nations who did avail themselves of those opportunities. Those who live among us could easily be mistaken for people of “white privilege” because they are usually indistinguishable until they pull rank and claim they are “indigenous”.

    More significantly, the idea of “hereditary elders” is so absurd in 2020, that I could not resist and just had to write a response to such authoritarian – let me repeat that – authoritarian longing for hereditary powers versus democratic systems that permit each person to have some input through a representative system of government, like the one we are supposed to enjoy without the anarchists continually attempting to destroy it.

    The cruelty suffered by those who were subjected to arbitrary decision-making by those who enjoyed HEREDITARY PRIVILEGE as hereditary rulers or hereditary elites is what motivated the departure of millions of people to come to a new land – our land – and acquire a voice in the decision-making. This hunger to be free from hereditary rule is at the heart of the very notion that created the “new world”.

    And that is what is now under threat of these anarchists in B.C. and many other parts of north American and the world.

    If you are nostalgic for hereditary rights that once gave people powers that were not earned or won through legitimate elections, then I feel compassion for you. It may be that you are misplaced in terms of historical times.

    In case you have not been keeping track of events over the past decade or so, there have been instigators from outside the regions affected by the disputes and to which protests should have been limited.

    You may want to check your sense of entitlement to demean people by using phrases like “white privilege” when many people now in Canada are of mixed ethnicity and various shades of skin color.

    It’s 2020 eaf.

    And we are living in what was intended to be a new system of governance – where the rule of law meant everyone was expected to allow others their right to enjoyment of our lands and to have freedom from fear and righteous riots that could easily explode into violence. That is the purpose of anarchy – to strike terror in the hearts of those who want to enjoy “peace” and “good government”.

    Now it is up to those who sought the right to be elected leaders, including members of the policing systems and judiciaries to fulfill their obligations.

    That, from what I understand, is all that Harvey is calling for.

    I suggest you check your calendar, eaf, or find a time machine and go back to the days where you think you’d have a better life – under the unearned and unelected hereditary rulers or hereditary elders.

    If you should find your nirvana where hereditary elders exercise their unwarranted privileges, and if they do allow each person a say in how their lives are affected, I hope you do not experience the reality of being silenced and bowed under the powers of the hereditary elders or the elites.

    May you have the life you’re calling for. Everyone should have their dreams or illusions come true – for them.

    (Response: You sum it up perfectly! Respect5 for elders …all elders, in every community …does NOT confer on ANY of them the right to VETO laws, the right to SUPERCEDE decisions of elected representatives or the right to IGNORE Court decisions/rulings. The problem is that our own “leaders” don’t understand that; are afraid to act; and/or even want to encourage insurrectionists yo promote/advance their own political agendas… BUT they too should be expected to obey the laws … and enforce them! h.o.)

  16. Jay says:

    The reason these groups get away with causing anarchy is simple. Look at antifa, black lives matter and all the other radical left wing groups that rose in the states. All they have to do is oppose Trump and they are sainted by the media and the left. Speaking against them in any way shape or form is racist, fascist and antidemocratic even though they are clearly the ones causing the racist, fascist and antidemocratic chaos. This has bled over into Canada where politicians are afraid to immediately be labled as a fascist for removing these protestors or homeless camps. THey don’t want to be labled racist for arresting the indigenous protestors. They don’t want to be called antidemocratic for stopping these violent actions by radical groups. This is alot about social justice warriors and PC culture that has gone out of control. Rule of law has been put aside by alot of politicians just to avoid the labels.

    (Response: I agree. Too many of our politicians … especially on the left … have abdicated their responsibilities to uphold the law. And the Courts have also been complicit: handing out reams of papers when laws are broken;but doing little or nothing of consequence when their orders are ignored. And anyone who dares to suggest/support/proclaim EQUALITY of all (that USED to be our ultimate goal) is now denounced by the far left as racist or privileged! The REAL privileged are now the anarchists and law-breakers … who know they have so many of our “leaders” on side or intimidated, they CAN get away with disrupting EVERYONE and ANYTHING! h.o.)

  17. D. M. Johnston says:

    I had my ears scorched on Facebook, by repeating much of the same, anarchists and Vancouver’s famous rent a mob, saw that we are being lead by cowards, civically, provincially, and federally and did what they damned well pleased.

    I am sure that others will post more definitive descriptions of our leaders at all levels, but I will simplify it with cowardice.

    We have let this happen by voting for cowards and allowing the yellow journalism of today to infiltrate into our printed and electronic media.

    We are all comfortably numb.

    With the train blockages it was monkey see and monkey do, all hoping for a cash payout to end it. The Mohawks in particular in Ontario and Quebec, which local economy includes vast amounts of smuggling (an honorable profession going back thousands of years) and are much annoyed with the feds trying to stop it.

    As for the hereditary chiefs, well the Queen is a hereditary leader and I do not see her stopping progress if she does not like it.

    The Tsawwassen first nation got a huge chunk of very good farm land with their settlement with the BC Liberals and what did the “great protectors of land do?

    Yup, blacked topped it with massive shopping malls, housing estates and industrial complexes.

    Where was the infamous rent-a-mob then?

    I also detest how academics are catering to the politically correct class (who winter in Arizona and Mexico), calling non indigenous peoples “settlers”, maybe in the 1800’s but not today and they are teaching this crap in universities.

    Most came to Canada and the USA because anything here, was a lot better than there!

    I am a 7th generation Canadian and not a f***ing settler.

    My great fear is what has happened is nothing more than a giant chess game, played by off-shore interests to weaken and fragment what was once a great country. It is called asymmetrical warfare and is well played by Russian and Chinese interests.

    There is a lot to gain to weaken Canada and sadly we have the cowards in control who would let this happen.

    With there first nations, there will never be “peace in our time” as they just cannot accept the fact that time has moved on, many reserves are not economically viable and their wanting to remain some sort of 1700’s throwback nation is doomed from the start.

    But I will underline, yes they have been treated badly, especially with the residential schools, which were an international magnet for pedophiles and other foul examples of humanity.

    But the Federal government has pumped 100’s of billions to the First Nations coffers and what has been done with that money?

    The First nation Issue will be solved by demographics as 2nd and 3rd generation Asian and south Asian voters, will have absolutely no truck or trade with indigenous issues as they came from families that worked 2 or 3 jobs to make a better life for their children and those children will have not much sympathy for those continually moaning about the past.

    Sad to say, but the upcoming generations will vote for non cowards, if there is still a country left.

    (Response: Mark my words …the feeble response of the NDP government … some say even amounting to de facto encouragement of the anarchists … could prove their Achilles heel in the next election. Remember, they weren’t exactly elected with a great majority! And if Horgan doesn’t take a stand and ACT to protect the public’s right to go about their business without intimidation, disruption, blackmail things will get even worse as the empowered anarchists expand their fun. Perfect opening for the BC Liberals if they can get their own act together. h.o.)

  18. hawgwash says:

    There is nothing in it for the politicians, whether they do something about this or not. No votes there.

    No real disruption to their daily cocooned lives. No hardships befall them if their new Mercedes is stuck on a train in Saskatoon.

    But wait, let a few shop owners on Keefer Street, whine about business losses due to a virus 8,000 km away and there they are, all the smiley politicians, rallying round in front of tipped off TV cameras. Votes there.

  19. BMCQ says:

    Hello Harvey

    I hope your repositioning went well and I hope your weather is as good as I have heard .

    An excellent Analysis and Critique on the Epidemic of Anarchy and literally Home Grown Terrorism we are currently facing right across Canada .

    I wonder if anyone in Media has the Moxy or the Courage to make some enquiries about who is providing funding for many of the so called Protesters infringing on the Rights and Democracy of Canadians attempting to Feed, House, and Provide for their Families ?

    Great Posts from 13, Leila, Jay, Jim, and many others, I tend to agree with Harry when he adds the Inept, Impotent, Preening, Prancing, and Insufferable PM Justin to the list of those Moronic Politicians that should face serious criticism for his/their refusal to Lead during this very serious time of Anarchy .

    PM Justin continually Mumble various silly juvenile phrases about “The Rule of Law” and the rest, when he really has no idea about what “Rule of Law” really mean .

    If the PM, Top Mensa Member and B.C. Premier Horgan, Anarchist B.C. Anarchist David Ebby, Geoff Meggs, the rest of the NDP Cabinet, Vancouver Mayor Stewart, the bulk of his Council, the Mayor of Victoria, Activist Judges, the RCMP, and other Police Forces believed in the “Rule of Law” they would have acted to keep Fail Lines, Streets, Transit, and every other mode of Transportation or Movement fully operational without any inconvenience of the Hard Working, Contributing, Tax Paying, General Public of ALL Levels of Income regardless of vocation .

    http://www.genuinewitty.com/2012/11/10/zoe-blunt-david-eby-olympic-violence-and-disappearing-legal-observers/

    Why is it that none of the Cowards now Masquerading as Leaders do not seem to give a Good God Damn about Law Abiding Citizens who often commute anywhere from say 45 minutes to over an hour to and from work each and every day, that can mean up to TWO Hours each and every Bloody Day ! Think about that !!

    Instead they are ALL collectively busy “Hiding Under their Desks” attempting to deflect and avoid any kind of accountability . Are ANY of You Surprised ?

    Media has done a fair job of covering this Catastrophic Disaster and Assault on Canadian Democracy but they should be asking tougher questions and holding those mentioned to account .

    And please don’t attempt to blame the Federal Conservatives, the B.C. Liberals, Alberta Conservatives, for this, as is usual the Politicians to blame for this are the Federal Liberals, the Federal soon to be extinct NDP, the B.C. NDP, and other activist Politicians who are responsible for this .

    Please explain to me, how can B.C. Genius and Premier John Horgan be in favour of one Pipeline and not the other ?

    What do you think Horgan, Eby or any of the other Activist Hypocritical Politicians would have said if it was Wilkinson’s Driveway that was blocked and he called in the Police who took a chance and Arrested a handful of Terrorists ? What if it was Scheers front driveway, Doug Ford. or Premier Kinney, would the Police even show up ?

    Jay and others here are correct, once you allow Terrorists to take hold of any Democracy it is all down hill from there . We lack Deterrence in all Western Society today and we will ultimately pay even a bigger price, you do not need to look too far, look at the almost Total collapse of most EU Nations, they are circling the drain and they will never recover .

    Now you know why the Great People of the “Soon to Be Free” UK Voted BRFEXIT .

    When you have elected Politicians like PM Justin, Premier Horgan, an actual Anarchist like David Eby as B.C. AG should we be surprised we now have Anarchy right across the Country ?

    You might know this better than I do Harvey, but is there not a saying that goes something like this ?

    “Citizens get the Government they Vote for and Deserve ” .

    Well I didn’t vote for any of them, just how many of you on this Blog can say that ?

    Most of the Protesters do not work, pay tax, obey other laws, and they literally hate our society, our values, and everything about respect for the vote, why should any of them receive special treatment of any kind . Please do not attempt to tell me that they are all hard working and put in 40 hours a week, No One with IQ above Room Temperature believes that any more .

    https://nationalpost.com/opinion/rex-murphy-climate-zealots-have-taken-canada-hostage-and-our-pm-is-missing-in-action

    Against my better judgement I have just made a very difficult decision to re-invest in the Province of B.C. and Canada . The only reason I decided to keep part of my company is because of the Hard Working, Loyal, Tax Paying, and Gifted Employees that built the company and keep it running like Precision Machinery .

    It would have been very easy to make the decision to move the business to the U.S. where we export about 60% of our Union Made B.C. Manufactured Product but I decided to stand with the Great People that make us a success .

    Even with the problems of High Taxation, Tax on Tax, Carbon Tax, Property Tax, Business Health Tax, ICBC, and all the rest we face the Good People of B.C. are more important .

    For anyone to condone and support in any the Anarchy that is taking place in regard to the Protesters and their Anarchy simply makes me question their values .

    Just ask yourself, Just WHO do you think provides the Tax Dollars to Fund Health Care, Education, Welfare, Pensions, the so called Justice System, Immigration, Infrastructure, and so much more ? Where does the Funding come from, please explain .

    oh and BTW, would any of you agreed with Andrew Wilkinson, Scheer, or Harper if any of them called the Police to remove so called Protesters from their front driveway ?

    Hell, at this point I even wonder if the RCMP would have even answered the call for assistance. Disgusting !

    e.a.f. – Re boot Re boot

  20. Dale White says:

    It is easy to scream and shake our fists at the clouds. How about some actual solutions.
    Sometimes I think there are people here who want Canada to roll in the tanks, clear the blockades and maybe for good measure drop a bomb on some reserve land and threaten to do it again unless Indigenous leaders give up their rights to unceded land.

    Of course that is ridiculous but so is the use of divisive name calling “TERRORISTS” which is insulting and not to the protesters but to the millions of people who have died and been displaced by actual terrorism.

    I am not angry at the “spineless” politicians who are afraid to confront the protesters. I am angry at the multitude of politicians who have ignored the problem of Indigenous rights for decades. And that includes Trudeau who has spoken about reconciliation since his election five years ago but now that the shit has hit the fan really doesn’t seem to have a way forward.

    But I am still optimistic. Indigenous leaders are well aware that we are at a watershed moment. Right now some leaders are calling for the protesters to step down that the point has been made. There are plenty of Indigenous owned businesses that will benefit from the pipeline. Polls indicate that most Canadians oppose the blockades but at the same time an equal or larger majority of Canadians want Indigenous rights to be addressed.

    Yes the protesters can walk away and get things back to normal, but unless government is willing to address Indigenous concerns we are just putting it off future protests.

    (Response: You seem to confuse the two separate issues as one: the First Nations protestors should and do have every right to protest, picket and challenge the gasline project on site, politically and in Court; but the anarchists have NO right to disrupt commuters going about their business, rail traffic across the country, bridges and border crossings just because they want to cause chaos. Inflicting harm on innocent civilians or holding people hostage IS a terrorist act. on They are two very different issues … and no government, no state should allow such acts to go unpunished … and never should any political leader negotiate with such terrorists. h.o.)

  21. e.a.f. says:

    It once was the law that people who did not own land were not permitted to vote.
    It once was the law that women were not permitted to vote.
    It once was the law people from China and India were not permitted to vote or be lawyers, doctors.
    It once was the law people who were Indigenous were not permitted to vote.
    It once was the law Asians, Jews, people of colour were not permitted to live in British Properties in West Vancouver.
    It once was the law Asians, Jews, people of colour were not permitted to join any number of golf and country clubs in Greater Vancouver.
    It once was the law people of colour were not permitted to purchase homes in specific areas of White Rock. those homes were built in the 1970s.
    It once was the law people of African descent could be owned by other humans.
    It once was the law people of African descent were not permitted to go to school or universities with whites.
    It once was the law people of African descent were not permitted ride in the front of the bus or use “white only” water fountains, bath room, seats in movie theatres, etc.

    I think you can all see where this is going.

    All these “were not permitted” things were changed and some of them were changed by protests which inconvienced many. They were unlawful, sometimes violent and always inconvient. While advancing their positions most of these groups “broke” the law in their areas. For those of you who do not remember, just google and watch the old video of marches in the South. there are also some interesting writings on what happened to women in this country when they tried to protest the lack of the right to vote–it wasn’t nice and these days unlawful, but back then a lot of people believed women and others had stepped out of their place and were ruining things for others.

    As I wrote, I agree with removing people from Oppenheimer Park, its just one big drug sales arena and dangerous. The other things, in my opinion, are up for debate. there are people who are being denied rights and the rights of Indigenous People have not yet been settled in this country. There still is an ocean of inequality and people have yet to gain equality on much of anything with out a long and drawn out fight.

    Some are of the opinion its all about the law. The law can be wrong and unjust. If we do not protest, things never change. No one gives up their power without others willing to struggle to take it from them. As to our elected officials, we are still arguing in this country about what constitutes a fair election. (I won’t go into the pro rated stuff). We all know money for decades has determined which political parties will and can be elected in all of our western democracies. Some may argue our laws are determined by those of privilege. I’d suggest most of us here are people of privilege.

    (Response: Looks to me like your heroes then would be Vladimir Lenin, Fidel Castro and Che Guevera; mine are Gandhi and Martin Luther King. H.O)

  22. 13 says:

    Oh the hypocrite, oh the irony , oh the double standard
    Horgan has stood by and watched the port of vancouver crippled by anarchists.
    Horgan has stood by and watched streets all over BC Blockaded
    Horgan has watched the legislature over run by criminals/anarchists
    Horgan watched transit and rail traffic illegally blocked
    Horgan had the anarchists/criminals arrested in his driveway
    Before anyone preaches about the anarchists crossing the line, save that bs for for someone else.
    They have placed peoples LIVES and livelihoods in jeopardy.
    Its way past time to arrest the criminals

  23. Jay says:

    This isn’t about privilege, it has never been about privilege. It has been about the political belief that certain groups have a privilege. That is ridiculous. Are there slaves in America, Canada or any modern western society? No. I am a caucasian male and I don’t have any special privilege. I still have to pay my bills and feed my family and go to work. No one is throwing subsidies to me or giving me equal opportunity at schools. No one is oppressing anyone in Canada these days. It is not societies fault is people have made mistakes in their lives.
    I work as a paramedic. I see alot of mistake people make. From drug use to bad health to stupidity. I don’t judge them. But i certainly don’t condone their activities. I absolutely do not condone anyone who oppresses another. The left doesn’t care about your view as long as it aligns with them. If you oppose them then you are the enemy and need to be destroyed. You will face immediate attack. IF you dare speak out against the left ideas you will soon find yourself a human outcast. Your job, life and family will be forfeit. There is no debate or middle ground.
    This is exactly why this kind of nonsense goes on. Don’t like drugs in your parks, you are a fascist who doesn’t understand that drug use is a medical problem. But god forbid you propose safe injection sites where people can have a safe place to use their drugs or decriminalization. Now you are a fascist or racist or whatever. The opioid epidemic is a result of politicians who cannot realize that throwing people in jail doesn’t work. Give them a safe place and a safe drug and their won’t be overdoses and deaths. Leave it up to the streets and nothing will stop this problem.
    Don’t like the violent protests? Then stop catering to the radicals just because you don’t wanna look bad to the SJW crowd and enforce the law.
    OMG we can’t look anti-immigrant because that would be bad. Even though we have no social structure to deal with the massive influx of immigrants. Trump bad for wanting to vet them. Why? should they or we just open the doors and let anyone in, in this day and age, when you have numerous groups who want to destroy our way of life?
    Politicians are caterers. They don’t know how to not appease. They are all about the compromise. But there must be a time when compromise is not acceptable.

    (Response: The far left have become the new fascists. It began on university campuses, denying those they disagree with even the right to speak; took over several unions, where radical extreme left political biases … including anti-Semitic policies … are approved; it expanded to city councils, where intolerance of minority rights is now commonplace in decisions; and, it is now very apparent in BC government inaction at stopping the modern-day brownshirts from intimidating, denying citizens their rights and ignoring the democratic principles of majority rule … and rule of law. h.o.)

  24. e.a.f. says:

    All 5 of them are heroes. They all faced different circumstances and if any one thinks the Tsar of Russia and the Russian military were going to turn over power and form a democracy, they didn’t have a good look at the Tsar and the Russian military. You could say Lenin and his went a tad too far, but there was never going to be change in Russia without some sort of violence. Remember the times.

    As to Castro, again, the American mob was never going to let go of their whore house. It just made them too much money. Batista came to power by a revolt. He was eventually backed by the American military and none of them were going to give up anything. If Cuba was ever going to be free, it would have been by a revolution.

    Gandhi and King were both involved with countries which were already on their way. G.B. knew it couldn’t win and King was lucky there were T.V. cameras.

    It is better if change comes from peaceful and lawful actions but we both know that isn’t possible. We all remember WW II. Now it may be claimed the pipeline protests aren’t of that magnitude but then we aren’t living the lives of those who are protesting. It is inconvenient, yes, its unlawful, yes, but nothing is going to change for the protestors or the Indigenous people in this country until the rest of us are mightly inconvenienced. Speaking “nicely” has never worked for the Indigenous people in this country. It was never on their schedule. It was on the government’s schedule, which resulted in a great deal of pain, poverty, disease, death for the Indigenous People. Young Indigenous People just aren’t going to sit around and wait any more. They have an opportunity now and they have seized it. yes, there are the usual “professional” protestors, who make it a way of life but with out them also, there wouldn’t be much change in our society. If it weren’t for “social unrest” we’d still be working 12 hr. days, 6 days a week, for $30 a month. In a manner of speaking many Indigenous People are still living in a world much like that.

  25. Harry Lawson says:

    Harvey

    Really where to start?

    [f our prime minister will not include the leader of the conservative party to a meeting of party leaders because of rhetoric how can he invite indigenous leaders for a discussion , like really????

    i am a person who posts under their real name , and yes i will be a social justice warrior until the day i die lol.
    and yes i am a social conservative .

    lets look at the who is funding the protesters, some say it is tides sone say it is the USA . all i know is decades of work is coming undone so who will profit?

    (Response: Trudeau is being hypocritical in excluding Scheer from discussions with other Canadian political leaders …just because he doesn’t like something he said: after all, it has always been Trudeau (ad his government’s) position that world conflicts should be settled by dialogue of all those with a stake … and surely the party leader of the Official Opposition has a stake and deserves a say. h.o.)
    .

  26. BMCQ says:

    By excluding any Federal Leader from the so called discussion on the Anarchist and Terrorist activities by the so called Protesters PM Justin tells the Canadian Public about himself, he once again exposes himself as being shallow, narcissistic, arrogant, dismissive, disrespectful, and much like a spoiled little boy he shows one and all he has as I have often said a Messiah Complex . He actually looks at Canadians like they are nothing more than his Flock and he will at one time or another attend to them but it will be under his conditions and rules .

    He actually has somehow convinced himself that he knows better and he has also convinced himself that he is better than other Federal Leaders but he also sees himself as AllKnowing and better than Canadians, the very people that pay the bills, he feels accountability to no one .

    I find it sort of interesting that all of a sudden Andrew Scheer seems to have found his voice and is showing Leadership on this issue, his opinions and Leadership on this make much sense and are supported by many Canadians regardless of Party affiliation, ethnicity, religion, or income level, it is quite unusual that Canadians agree on something like that . We must also take note that Ontario and Quebec are under stress due to the fact that goods and services are being kept away and delayed by the interference with Rail Lines, not to mention that hard working Canadians are losing pay Chequers .

    To me it shows the Anarchists, Protesters, PMJustin, Singh, the B.C. Premier Horgan, Eby, Vancouver Mayor Stewart, and the rest are on the wrong side of history .

    I can only wonder that if Scheer may have found his voice and took a firmer stance during the last election campaign the Conservatives May have formed Government and we might not be in this situation as PM Justin would be back teaching drama .

    Instead after only a few months of the re election of PM Justin Canada is coming apart at the seems, we can’t build pipelines, our oil and gas is land locked and sells at a 50% discount, Quebec refuses to allow a National Energy Hwy, we can’t control migration, secure borders, we cannot keep sex offenders and other violent criminals in jail, we can’t convict criminals much of the time, we have bigger deficits with an out of control Debt, and we are not far off from being in a “Death Spiral” .

    In the meantime PM Justin speaks in platitudes and mumbles about the “Rule of Law” .
    Yeah, sure, you tel us .

    Please ask yourself this most important question, where are the “States People Kind” when we need them ?

    As it now stands, “The Tail is Wagging the Dog” and Canadians deserve better, PM Justin and his Brand of Politics are just not up to the challenge .

    Canada and Canadians need Leadership and we need it now, we cannot suffer through four more years of this, time is running out and there is no more time to waste .

    (Response: Politicians always seem to develop greater clarity, stronger opinions and louder voices … when they are LEAVING office. Sad. h.o)

  27. BMCQ says:

    I have attached something here that I think anyone following this story should find interesting .

    https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/who-are-the-protesters-theres-a-lot-of-people-that-arent-from-these-communities-that-arent-aboriginal

    Harvey – response to Harry

    You state that PM Justin is being hypocritical .

    In fact he is far more than that, the Canadian Prime Minister is acting no differently than Venezuela’s Dictator and Military Strong People Kind Nicolas Maduro .

    Just exactly would Media and some on this say if Harper did similar during his Terms?

    And seeing that we are all still here, I must say that I find it rather pathetic, weak kneed, and greatly concerning that the RCMP are actually talking publicly about standing down to appease Radical First Nations Terrorists and Anarchists .

    That I can guarantee you will not be enough, from there it will go on and just wait, the weather is now beginning to turn to Spring so all of the Protesters Groups will expand by thousands as Students get out of School for the summer . Then to top it off about 90% of them will be protesting with full bellies provided by the Hard Working Tax Payer of Canada . What a life !

    Each and every day it just seems to get worse, someone please help Canada, we are in Deep Deep Trouble .

    (Response: Trudeau = Maduro? That’s just silly. h.o.)

  28. Leila Paul says:

    The premiers and Trudeau can talk all they want. The issue will be temporarily defused. But it’s only temporary, for this is just one more phase in what is now an irreversible direction.

    The RCMP have yielded to the demands of the gangsters. That’s nice. Now we can all sleep more peacefully and hope the blockades will soon and and our economy may not have suffered too much more.

    This column, Harvey, is reminiscent of the one discussing the U.N.’s interference in our national and provincial sovereignty when it authoritatively and unilaterally declared the BC legislature must submit to a veto of legislation by the “first nations”. So that outside interference is succeeding in breaking up Canada – step by step.

    As for some of the references to riots and even violence being necessary to bring about “justice” I was appalled to read the statement that maybe the Bolsheviks and Lenin went a “tad” too far. A “tad” too far? Is that like a tad too much salt in the soup? Or a tad too much cream in the coffee?

    Tsar Nicholas and his family were butchered by drunken, inept barbarians who needed 20 minutes or more (according to historical forensic analysis) to butcher the Tsar and his five children. I’m sure those interested can read for themselves what was hidden and then revealed by the supreme leftists who were seeking social justice by butchering a family. The Soviets – the supreme form of social justice as it was then called – eventually allowed bits of the truth to be revealed in a few episodes many years after the fact.

    Once uncontrolled aggression is unleashed it creates an environment where what appears to be insanity governs the minds of the terrorists and they are allowed to dictate terms to entire masses of people.

    Step by step, those with a sense of self-righteousness do not know when they’ve gone over the line.

    However, since the rebellion is now in full sway and may only be temporarily put on pause, it may be time for others to find groups with which they can identify. If this is only one chapter or episode in an irrevocable trend, people should start carving out their turf where they can claim “sovereignty” and create their own “governments” as the “hereditary” clans are doing.

    Bit by bit, drop by drop, inch by inch, weakness and propitiation of the bizarre conduct of politicians and police agencies are allowing the concept of a nation that was Canada to be carved up into sovereign ‘nations’ within what was once a true nation.

    It was once so peaceful and life seemed so rational and merit-based in all aspects of Canadian life. Laws were respected. Governments did not abdicate their obligations and gangs were not called “indigenous” nations with rights to sovereignty. If generations earlier had not agreed to forfeit territory when they lost a war it seems now those who claim to be the descendants are the beneficiaries of their “loss” and can now claim they are reversing reality of a war that once seemed so long ago.

    We thought our worst problems were within Quebec and Pierre Trudeau came under harsh criticisms for his immediate and forceful actions to stop the FLQ. Perhaps his and other politicians’ later appeasements have inevitably encouraged actions that are now in full bloom.

    How ironic that his feeble minded and weak-kneed heir is now in the role that could have shown Justin to be the leader we need, but we always suspected he was not.

    Is this when we can sing “Oh Canada”? Is this when we can ask why are we still subjects of the Queen and paying for Governors General over all these years, as well as all the Lieutenants General in the provinces over all these many decades? If they do not have a legal role in this mayhem, do they have a moral role? If not, then why are we funding them as well as the RCMP that capitulates to gangsters?

    Is anyone in charge? Can someone identify who our leaders are?

    If not, where and when do we surrender to the gangs who will now be further emboldened?

  29. BMCQ says:

    The reference to Madura was simply used to compare the Canadian Prime Ministers juvenile behavior of excluding Her Majesty’s Loyal Opposition Leader and Conservative Party who represents millions of Canadian Voters from the conversation which is hoping to find a solution for a National Crisis .

    If that is not a good example of a PM behaving like a Dictator what is ?

  30. helena handcart says:

    Good grief, HO. You really know how to push the outrage button for all your Colonel Blimp splutterers and knuckledraggers. As soon as I read your article, I could have written the comments from your usual suspects. You ask: “And WHY do the police do almost nothing when un-elected mobs of fascists disrupt public roads, bridges, services, offices?” I agree. Much better to have the elected mobs of fascists close the roads instead. I live in downtown Vancouver . I doubt that there is a single road, street or sidewalk that is not blocked for the convenience of some construction company or another. We seem to be OK with closing the Burrard bridge for a Yoga session so the CC could cosy up to Mr. Lululemon, or shutting down streets for Greek Days or any number of other events. Apparently it is OK to use the parks for a massive fireworks event or the Folk festival, but somehow a “pot” event is a no no. People have a right to demonstrate. It is called democracy. The police are well able to handle those who break the law. Let them get on with their job in their own way.
    That “fascist, moron Horgan and his Mensa buddy Eby” have a lot to answer for. We need that waste of space, Jas Johal to run things.

    (Response: Democracy is in DEEP trouble if people cannot see the difference between elected officials making decisions and implementing them … even those we may not agree with or like … and unelected activists, anarchists, brownshirts demanding they rule and decide … shutting down bridges, rail lines, the port etc to force capitulation by police and government. If you can’t see the difference between mob blockades and road/sidewalk disruptions for legallu approved construction … that’s YOUR problem, not mine. h.o)

  31. Leila Paul says:

    It should not surprise me anymore, but why is it that those who use demeaning terminology, are those whose comments imply they think they are morally superior sympathizers of the downtrodden or exploited?

    I refer to the comment by Helena Handcart, hereafter to be HH.

    There is no excuse for calling people knuckledraggers or Colonel Blimp splutterers when those words are completely unnecessary to make a statement or a rebuttal – if the statement has intrinsic merit.

    I’m not sure why HH put this phrase in quotes: “fascist, moron Horgan and his Mensa buddy Eby”. I don’t know who HH is quoting because I have not found that statement on this page.

    However, one might assume, by the tone of HH’s comment, that HH believes he/she is qualified to be a Mensa member. I will confess I doubt this to be so.

    HH’s courage to issue demeaning labels, while hiding behind an alias, is only surpassed by the implicit intellectual superiority with which HH regards his/her opinion. But HH’s presumed superiority of knowledge is wholly unjustified.

    If HH is referring to Neanderthals as the knuckledraggers, then, HH, you are way behind in your knowledge. I suggest you do some research. Lots of archeological research is now online revealing they had larger brains that modern humans and had a highly complex culture.

    Perhaps if HH is looking for knuckledraggers, a good place to find them in huge numbers might be among the antagonistic anarchists seeking to destroy a formerly orderly country.

    But if HH thinks rail blockades, that have been occurring since December 31st (by some reports), is equivalent to a one-day festive occasion, then HH is unlikely to understand how these blockades damage the Canadian economy and put people out of work. Layoffs have already occurred.

    That does not even begin to address the overall goals of the malicious motivations underlying the chaotic and aggressive protests.

    These are not demonstrations. These activities are aimed at further undermining the economy at a time when Canada’s economy is already vulnerable.

    Then there’s the intimidation factor. But, if HH believes these protests to be equivalent with a festive one-day event, then HH is either willingly self-deceptive or simply unable to comprehend the ramifications of what’s occurring.

    No doubt HH’s Mensa member friends might give HH some rudimentary insights into the potential consequences.

    A cultural or yoga event may actually benefit the economy if it brings in expenditures by visitors. So too does construction. It employs people and creates housing.

    If HH does not see the difference, then he/she is wise to hide behind an alias.

  32. Harry Lawson says:

    harvey

    solution is simple , you have a parliament sitting, you have a country held hostage . the government has the tools , pass a law that clearly states any person blocking a road ,railway or any form of transportation is illegal and subject to immediate arrest with a visit to a judge, . years ago i made a decision to defy a back to work order by the government against the postal workers , and yes i had a date with a judge . i also was willing to go to jail . under the same circumstances i would do it again lol parliament has all the tools ,just mo craftsmen.

    (Response: We don’t need new laws: they are already there. What we need is politicians who LIVE by them, ENFORCE them, instead of CAVING in to the anarchists. h.o)

  33. Jason says:

    Feeble, a word you used late in your piece, is the key word here. I’m absolutely amazed that a mob can shut down a major intersection (Broadway and Commercial on the 19th) and face no consequences. The stunt on the CN Lines in East Vancouver on the weekend (15th and 16th of February) was even more ridiculous. I don’t understand why it was left to CN to get a civil injunction to clear that protest. They were blocking Renfrew Street near Grandview and the Vancouver City police should have enforced the traffic laws to move them off quickly. (Interesting to note, all of these protests are blocking major bus routes that connect to Skytrain. How can one be an environmentalist and disrupt public transit which is surely the best way to reduce carbon emissions?)

    There seems to be this strange idea going around, especially on social media and even in some of the more traditional media outlets too, that a reasonable and measured response to these illegitimate protest tactics would be authoritarian. I don’t think that any reasonable person wants to suppress freedom of assembly or speech. People who oppose this pipeline are free to protest in front of the Art Gallery, the Federal Government buildings at Library Square, City Hall, or in front of the Offices of an Energy company. I’d be the first to support peaceful information pickets, leafleting, and even noisy (but peaceful) rallies. I’d even be sympathetic to a one off demonstration through Downtown Vancouver on a weekend to let people have their say without creating total chaos.

    But blocking a public highway is a step too far. It’s a criminal act and those who engage in it should, as you say, be arrested and prosecuted for it. We are a free society but we also have the rule of law and to have the former without the later would lead to disaster.

    But, back again to ‘feeble’. There have been prosecutions for people breaking civil injunctions in Burnaby on the Trans Mountain Route. Mayor Stewart and the MP Elizabeth May both received fines after guilty pleas and some people have received short sentences (7-30 days in most cases but most end up serving only 2/3 of the sentence due to overcrowding in the provincial corrections department). Interestingly, I read a story a few months ago about a demonstrator who blocked access to an abortion clinic and received a 6 month jail sentence! I believe she was a repeat offender but it’s an interesting example of how the law treats different types of protest. (And I’d say the same thing for the abortion protestor: it’s perfectly legitimate to peacefully oppose abortion but when you break the criminal law by blocking access to a clinic providing a legal medical procedure, that’s a step too far).

    I agree that the Premier has to get a handle on this fairly soon; maybe having his driveway blocked for a morning might help move things along! He should remember that being an NDPer doesn’t mean being a pushover. Mike Harcourt, the former storefront lawyer and civil libertarian, had to use some strong arm tactics in 1993 during those protests over logging on Vancouver Island. I think 1,000 people at one point were arrested. The one practical problem today would be the criminal justice system. Harcourt had more resources to work with then. The lack of courthouses and prosecutors makes it very difficult to get people to trial. And if they were convicted, half of the provincial jails have been closed (cutbacks courtesy of the last BC Liberal government, thanks again Mr Campbell and Coleman), so there would be no place to send them. A perfect example of the weakness law: last month, a break and enter artist with over 100 convictions dating back 25 years received barely 14 months for his latest offense, which involved theft from a cancer charity. Global had a story on the 6 O’clock news tonight about the epidemic of property crime but no one seemed to be able connect the dots and give a broader answer as to why its happening.

    I don’t have much hope that order will be restored soon, given the performances of the politicians we have at the Federal level. The Tories don’t seem to have a statesman among their ranks, the NDP clearly haven’t moved on from campus politics, and the Liberals are aimless and wandering. It all feels a bit . . . what’s that word again? Oh yeah . . . feeble.

    (Response: IT’s so sad and very dangerous for our future: our “leaders” at municipal, provincial and federal levels are afraid to do their jobs and I believe some even SUPPORT the insurrectionists. And it’s no coincidence that these governing bodies ALL are led by left-leaning politicians/parties …. and its they who could pay the heaviest price down the road. Giving in to mob rule, anarchists and unelected self-designated dictators will not win support/votes of the majority. h.o.)

  34. Gilbert says:

    We need to enforce the law. Otherwise we invite anarchy and chaos.

    The laws of our country should apply to everyone. No group should be given preferential treatment. It’s so simple, but apparently many of our politicians lack the ability to show leadership. It’s so sad.

    (Response: Perfectly put! But looks like things are getting WORSE: reports say the feds are now willing to cave in to the unelected hereditary chiefs’ demands and order the RCMP out of the disputed area. Incredible! h.o)

  35. frozentundra says:

    Hi Harvey:

    This might be a bit drastic, but it is looking like our democracy is hitting its end of the Roman Empire moment where the politicians (like the Roman Emperors in the 300 and 400 AD) realized that the mob they created had become out of control. Everyone wanted the rights and gifts of Roman society but did not want to work for it. As a result the society rotted from within and was washed to history’s relic bins by the Vandals and Visigoths in the 5th century.

    Appeasing the mob of anarchists, Marxists, activists, etc is never going to work. They will want more and more and more as they realize that the central government doesn’t want to face the problem, but wants to kick it down the road. Before we know it, there will be anarchy as people will not believe in the rule of law. Already hearing it lots as people say ” Why should I obey the law if it doesn’t suit what I am thinking?” This is dangerous as fairly soon people who usually follow the law see people getting away with threats, intimidation, trespassing and go ” Why should I care about my speeding ticket or I don’t like the way my neighbours car is parked. Lets spray paint it or burn it”

    I know what I said above is worst case scenario, but this moment could be a pivotal point in Canada’s history. Is Trudeau going to be a 21st century Neville Chamberlain appeasing the mob with “peace in our time” or is he going to be more of a Churchill/Roosevelt type who will stand up for law and order.

    Harvey, I don’t advocate sending the army in to settle this, but we need more than vague platitudes to solve this issue. Trudeau has to point out to the people of Canada that he is prepared to take firm action if this drags on and the blockades don’t end, otherwise this will escalate to somewhere no one who believes in a Canada wants it to go, which is crap like vigilante justice and open rebellion.

    (Response: Your impression/concern about the threat to democracy is not drastic at all. I have worried about that too … not just based on the current mob rule intolerance infecting and WINNING in Canada, but what has happened elsewhere as well. In the US, the rule of law has been diminished as well … and most don’t seem very concerned; in Europe, democracy-lessening regimes on the far right have already taken power in Poland and Hungary and are making inroads in other countries; and even though democratic rights/rules have been pushed back in Russia, Putin remains popular; and don’t get me started on the dictator-for-life now running China. We don’t need the army to restore democracy in BC/Canada …we need our politicians to do their jobs: respect and enforce the laws; and allow the police to do so too. And we need Courts to do more than issue pieces of useless paper that the anarchists can ignore without any real consequences. h.o)

  36. D. M. Johnston says:

    A few days later………..

    The national shake down by the environmental terrs and first nations continues.

    The mayor of Vancouver has done a disappearing act, good little socialist he, and the Premier, well, even though blockaded his house, has done little, if anything to deter what has become a national embarrassment.

    Trudeau sits on the sharp precipice of a minority government trying not to offend anyone is ending up offending everyone.

    And the national shakedown continues unabated.

    This is not environmentalism, oh hell no because we have the example of Tsawwassen Mills and Tsawwassen Commons and the vast housing and industrial estates, blacktopped over prime farm land on the TFN.

    Where were the protesters then? Probably could not afford bus fare.

    What has been shown, is that Canada is no different than the excited states and that fake news and alternative facts rule the land.

    The law, well it only applies to us other Canadians, but not to money launderers, international gangsters and other vile miscreants that seem to flourish here.

    The law, it seems does not apply to first nations and the fear of politicians of their civil disobedience and criminal acts have shown them for what they are, cowards.

    When will our current sad sack lot of politicians learn that appeasement and cowardice just does not a nation make.

    Internationally, Canada is seen to be ruled by cowards and as history has shown, cowardly nations do not last long.

    That whirring sound you hear are those killed in war time, lauded over by politicians on the 11th of November for fighting for freedom etc., spinning in their graves.

    (Response: Amazing! The feds are caving to the blackmail by unelected protestors : https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/rcmp-withdraw-bc-1.5469669 The message this sends to agitators, anarchists and even terrorists will only ENCOURAGE more disruptions, blackmail demands in the future. The rule of law in Canada is being pushed aside for political expediency … and Trudeau’s personal hopes of winning a UN Security Council seat! h.o)

  37. DonGar says:

    Blackmail pays $2.1 billion. Who’s next?

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/indigenous-government-spending-blockades-1.5470670

    (Response: Disgraceful! At some point, some government(s) are going to have to stop being “played” for fools. And the voters are going to have to stop voting into office weak “leaders” who shovel out public millions so easily to pressure groups and cave in to pressure, demands and blackmail from agitators, anarchists. Remember it’s ALL coming out of YOUR pockets … whoever signs the cheques. h.o.)

  38. helena handcart says:

    HO. I hope that you will allow me to respond to Leila.
    He/she asks why it is necessary to use demeaning terminology. In an earlier response he/she uses the following: gangsters, drunken, inept barbarians, feeble minded and weak-kneed heir. Our friend, Battling Bob uses this phrase: “Inept, Impotent, Preening, Prancing, and Insufferable PM Justin to the list of those Moronic Politicians.” That apparently does not outrage Leila. “Neanderthal?” I never used that word.(though I did enjoy visiting the Font de Gaume). “Mensa” never claimed that distinction, but it is a favourite expression of another contributor. I do, however, have an opinion on some of the things that Harvey documents. It is my style to use irony, brevity and sarcasm in my comments. Not everyone has to be a pompous, verbose, sanctimonious windbag. If you are desperate to know my identity, ask Harvey.

  39. DonGar says:

    So in addition to causing the economy billions and thousands of people lost wages they get rewarded with big $ How does Justin spell dialogue $$$$$$$$$$$$$

    Maybe a class action law suit to get back money for damage to economy and another for all those who lost wages.

    (Response: A class action suit would pay off …for the lawyers on both sides! I think a better …and less costly solution in the log run for taxpayers …would be throw out of office in the next lections those politicians who encourage or cave in to the anarchists, agitators and blackmailers. h.o.)

  40. Leila Paul says:

    @ HH:

    All the examples you used of derogatory descriptions are directed at those demonstrators who are breaking the laws and not those who have posted on this blog.

    Those aggressive disruptive antagonistic protestors have not behaved respectfully towards others but have caused people to lose their jobs, money, a sense of safety, the freedom of movement and those other values that make a society free, orderly, and managed by accountable institutions.

    Your derogatory terms were lobbed at some of us who have made comments on this blog.

    Do you see the difference? None of us on this blog are (presumably) part of the radical mobs inciting the destruction of our prosperity and orderly way of life.

    When I have attempted to refute someone, I have not (that I can recall) ever used a derogatory term in criticizing their comments.

    I suggest you re-read your comment and see if it actually represents what you intended to say.

    I, for one, would like to know that when I express my opinion within the boundaries of free speech, I am doing so with good intentions and avoiding the intent of belittling the minds or opinions of others.

    If I have failed to do so, I do not think it can be seen in this column.

    As to your identity, Harvey would never reveal someone’s identity if they chose to use an alias.

    I, however, am a female using my own name. I am not afraid to show that I believe, in good will, that my opinion is as accurate as I’m able to recognize.

    As for my being verbose – I was attempting to find ways of rebutting your comments without resorting to short labels or very few words.

    If my old-fashioned attempt makes me a “sanctimonious windbag”, I suggest you (again) re-read your comment and see who is sanctimonious. Also, since your comment did little more than to insult some of us on this blog, then I’d suggest your comment may better suit the description of “windbag”.

    Out of respect for Harvey, I will apologize to you and hope that when I read and if/when I post a comment, I need not worry about being labeled a knuckledragger or a Colonel Blimp sputterer.

    I hope you’ll agree that is a reasonable expectation out of respect for the concept of free speech and the freedom to express opinions. This is particularly where the pejoratives are NOT directed at people on this blog but the actual lawbreaking protestors.

    (Response: Enough now. Let’s get back to the topic of the blog. h.o)

  41. e.a.f. says:

    oh, my this is fun and some the comments are deluxe. Harvey great topic which certainly got all of us expressing ourselves in our normal manner. Doubt if any of us are going to change each others minds.

    While I was looking at the comments, the 11 p.m. news was reporting on the “dissatisfaction” many condo owners are starting to express regarding the inability for their strata’s to obtain insurance. They want a meeting with Horgan. Wonder how many of us will feel if the condo owners follow the example of the Mohawks and the Wet’suwet’un Hereditary chiefs and their supporters. White privilege, Hereditary Chief privilege, financial 1%er privilege, racist privilege, even knuckle dragger privilege. Its usually just about whose hand is in the cookie jar or whose ox is being gored.

    Helena handcart, you do have something there about all the road closures for construction, a closed road is a closed road.
    Leila, I think part of Helena handcart’s comments were meant to be humours, well I thought the comments about the road closures were funny. Lots of us use alternative methods of identification.

    As to knuckle draggers, haven’t heard that term since the 1970s, the term like the protests reminds me of my “misspent” youth. It might be fun to do one more decent protest before I exit stage left. Actually its quite fun to have a court injunction issued against you, which you defy, when you’re young. Its exhilarating actually.

    As one sibling said, nice to see real protests in B.C. again. Been awhile.

    (Response: If those condo owners blocked a bridge for one hour, they would no doubt be arrested, charged, face fines and even jail if they returned and continued their protest actions. You have to be very radical, anarchistic with a record o refusing to obey laws, injunctions, Court decisions etc to qualify for today’s Special Status Agitators Treatment and then be allowed to do whatever you want without any real consequences and of course, have the governments cave in to your demands … maybe even pay you cash for disrupting the lives of the rest of us, hurting the economy, closing bridges and ports, shutting down the rail lines … and impacting thousands of jobs. Some “leaders” we have! h.o.)

  42. Jay says:

    A “tad”…the communist revolution led to millions of deaths.
    The revolution in Cuba led to thousands of deaths and a system that caused thousands to die trying to get out of the country.
    “Heroes”, well to the people that lived at that time maybe but history will never look at them as heroes. They caused death, destruction and in the case of the communists, almost led to a nuclear war.
    World war 2 ended the colonial era. And it should have. The problem is that the communist regime embraced that change as a reason to seize territory that they had to no right to.
    Oh we can argue that they fought and won this territory in war but the end of the nazi regime should have meant giving back the territory that was lost to the people of those states. The countries that were seized by Germany should have been freed but guess what, they weren’t. Most were annexed by the communists. China became communist. And as a result tens of thousands died.
    Cuba? well gee yes the revolution might have resulted in a non american country but they have a terrible situation now. Cuba is a waste land compared to most comparable countries.
    They spent a lot of time under the soviet yolk and almost led the world to annihilation.

    Revolution can be a good thing, in revisionist history. The American revolution, led by what we might can terrorists today, led to a mighty new country. Anarchy however, has never led to anything but death and mayhem. One must always pick their battles.

  43. Leila Paul says:

    One of the unusual features of traditional aboriginal groups is their matriarchy. The following may already be common knowledge to most Canadians, but I wanted a reminder for myself of the background.

    If they’ve forgotten, others may also find this useful in understanding the complexities that need unraveling before a resolution can even approach realistic expectations to solve these types of confrontations once and for all:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/21/world/canada/pipeline-blockades-explainer.html?searchResultPosition=8

    Do All Wet’suwet’en People Oppose the Pipeline?

    …figuring out what the consensus is within their community is a difficult task in part because the First Nation has two different leaderships. ….

    Despite their title, hereditary chiefs do not automatically assume office or hold it indefinitely. Last year, three of them, all women who are in favor of the pipeline, were stripped of their titles and replaced by men — a move which they say is inconsistent with Wet’suwet’en traditional law. Lawyers for the current hereditary chiefs have argued in court that the women received funding from the provincial government to promote the pipeline. …

    “We established the matrilineal coalition, and the reason for that was to try to bring economic benefits to our young people,” Ms. George said.

    My notes from here on that I hope others can answer:

    An obvious question I ask is – Did the women hereditary chiefs accept funds and, if so, was it from the provincial government and were these actual bribes by the province or intended to assist unemployed clan members?

    Natives claim they have suffered injustices and neglect for multiiple decades or a couple centuries and today’s Canadians are suffering minor inconveniences in comparison. But being laid off and having other sectors of Canada’s economy suffer is serious and will affect everyone eventually.

    Meanwhile, the growing global occurrences of the cornonavirus is reportedly harming the global economy. If Canada’s economy suffers further within a declining global economy – what are the ramifications for all of us?

    Many of you have probably read this Financial Post report. If not, it warrants reading:

    https://business.financialpost.com/news/economy/choke-point-how-the-blockade-movement-has-sent-tremors-across-canadas-economy-and-beyond

    One final concern I have is that this latest confrontation shows that we have a number of Canadians who see themseves as apart and separate from the rest of us. Along with the alienation from us Canadians, they will not hesitate to act in ways to make us feel financial pain and what they see as minor “inconveniences” while they believe themselves so aggrieved that, as one sign by the protestors stated: Reconciliation is Dead.

    If, as reported in a number of news outlets, there are many non-natives among the protestors, what are their goals?

    Are those goals likely to benefit either Canada as a whole or all the various native tribes now joining forces against us “non-natives” whom they appear to see as the enemy?

    I hope I’m not overstating the distance and intensities of hostilities among all the various groups – Canadians and clans and non-Canadians whose interests may be unrelated to native concerns or our concerns.

    How do we get out of this seemingly irreconcilable impasse while avoiding serious violence?

    If it lasts too much longer, the economic ramifications, considering the global concerns, may be beyond an early recovery – and could result in serious hardships and poverty.

    I hope others have a more optimistic view and can offer peace of mind that comes with hope.

    How do we resolve this peacefully and prevent recurring events even if they take differing shapes over other issues in future disputes.

  44. BMCQ says:

    Leila

    I was just about to go out the door but I thought I would have a quick look to see if any gems were posted on this Blog over night and I see you have posted one of the very best Posts I have seen since my arrival here in August of 2015 .

    Take a Bow!

    Harvey’s initial Analysis and Commentary and your Gem just posted should be Re printed and Broadcast in every single Media Outlet as well as Print and Internet right across Canada, the Western World, the UN and most importantly in the Office and Caucus of every single PC, SJW, Activist Politician in Canada, including PM Justin, Butts, their Minions, soon to be Ex NDP Leader Singh, B.C. Premier Horgan, his Brain Geoff Meggs, Anarchist DAVID Eby, Caped Crusader and Protector of the Public Mikey Farnworth, the rest of the Empty NDP Cabinet, Vancouver Mayor Stewart, Victoria Mayor Helps, the dithering and disengaged RCMP, Vancouver Police Chief Barney Fife and his Squad of “Crossing Guards”, and far too many in Media that did not and have not thought to ask the most important questions you have just asked and exactly what the “Great Unwashed” deserved answered .

    Vaughn Palmer, M Smyth, Baldrey and a few others have provided excellent coverage on this most serious problem but most of the rest simply fall in behind PM Justin and can’t even get up the courage to challenge him on his ridiculous claims about “Rule of Law” .

    PM Justin is not familiar with, does not respect, and really has no understanding of what “Rule of Law” really means, his definition of “Rule of Law” is Governed by what the Polls happen to be telling him and Butts, and what a crying shame that is for the Tax Payer and REAL Canadians that actually understand and believe in the “Rule of Law” .

    You, Harvey and others are correct, we have a Cancer growing in Canadian Society and we need to correct it quickly or we are in serious trouble, we cannot afford to have the Tail Wag the Dog, Special Interests of any kind have no right to any entitlements that do harm to our Great Democracy .

    If Politicians and Police continue to Bow Down to Special Interests things will only get worse and quickly .

    BTW

    How can anyone compare sidewalk and road repair to Anarchist behavior that STOPS the Economy, breaks the Law and causes Hard Working, Tax Paying Canadians attempting to support Families from getting a Pay Cheque ?

    Think just a minute about that .

  45. G. Barry Stewart says:

    Maybe THIS will throw some cold water on the issue — and everyone can back off while it’s getting settled: “The environmental agency that oversees resource projects in British Columbia has put a portion of the Coastal Gaslink project on hold.”

    The rule of law also includes environmental assessments, which always preclude the ‘go-ahead’ on any project.

    The assessment authority has concerns over the area known as “the remaining portion of the Morice River Technical Boundary Area,” where there’s been standoff with the RCMP.

    The EAO must be under intense pressure, so it’s remarkable that they are maintaining their autonomy in this case.

    Their letter to Coastal GasLink: https://www.projects.eao.gov.bc.ca/api/document/5e4dd24fa7a9480021d3d3d8/fetch/356061_Forrest_FINAL.pdf

    ATPN’s coverage: https://aptnnews.ca/2020/02/21/b-c-environmental-agency-puts-portion-of-coastal-gaslink-pipeline-on-hold/

    Norm Farrell’s coverage: https://in-sights.ca/2020/02/21/ruled-by-climate-change-deniers/

    In his piece, Norm stresses — among other points — the poor value we are getting out of natural gas. “According to a report found among Labour Market Statistics at BC Stats, oil and gas extraction accounts for less than one-fifth of one-percent of jobs in this province.” Visually, that’s from the knees down, of one worker out of 100 workers.

    Further, “In fiscal year 2020, natural gas is providing one-quarter of one-percent of total provincial revenue. In fiscal year 2009, natural gas provided ten-percent of the British Columbia Government’s total revenue.”

    The real questions are: Where have all the profits gone — and how are we going to get rich, by selling off our resources for peanuts? What are we doing this for?

    (Response: Can somebody please tell me WHY the rule of law only applies to ONE side on all issues these days???? Certainly never the activists, anarchists, obstructionists and environmental terrorists. h.o)

  46. helena handcart says:

    Like Ms. Paul, I would be interested to discover how the hereditary chiefs are chosen. Were the three women voted out by a majority of band members? Was there an illegal coup?. It would be nice if someone familiar with the Wet’suwet’en system of governance could comment. My understanding is that it is a Matriarchal society. The hereditary titles are passed down through the females. I well remember visiting Gwaii Haanas and being in no doubt that the young woman that guided us was running the show. There was only one boss, and it was NOT the hefty men that accompanied her.

  47. e.a.f says:

    Anarchists and communists, they all caused the lose of life, as have democratic countries. Did you forget the Iraq Invasions. How about the invasion of Libya. then there are the colonial powers who caused millions of deaths. Have a look at what Europeans did in the east, Africa and India. Its more like, they all did it. Killing is part of change because no one gives up power willingly. No one is without blame.

    Now when it comes to Cuba, yes I know we’re off topic here, but its about revolution, and that is what we’re seeing with the blockades, you can get better medical care there than many Americans can get in the U.S.A. if you’re giving birth you have a better chance of dying in the U.S.A. than in Cuba. You can also get medications in Cuba you can’t afford in the U.S.A. Yes, things are a “tad” dictatorial in Cuba, but do you want to die of a disease you don’t have to, or live with a dictatorial system.

    speaking of death and destruction, the American civil war resulted in approx. half a million deaths. for the time, it was a lot. the U.S.A. in my opinion, isn’t really a great country. Its a great place to make a lot of money, but not a great country. Have a look at it today. O.K. it was sort of great for those of European descent. African descent, not so much. Cops still kill you more frequently if you’re a person of colour in the U.S.A. than if you’re “white”./

    There are those who still are a “tad” upset about the Nazis and what they did. The Indigenous Peoples of North American may hold similar views of us, the European descent group. How were the European descent types any different than the Nazi’s. Both parties had concentration camps, we just called them Reservations. On a % basis I’d imagine the death rate was about the same, but during the 1700, 1800, 1900s not many were counted. Want to know how many people have had early deaths due to the mercury poisoning in Grassy Narrows. We will most likely never know how many Indigenous children died in residential schools. If your family had children who went there, you might not view the pipeline with any real favour. its just another invasion. That is not to say, there aren’t “professional protestors”.

    Leila, I don’t think too many of the protestors are concerned about the “economic” issues the protests may cause. Some of them have not been part of the “vibrant” first world economy. Some may argue they benefited, but not in what I’d call any meaningful way. You and I have benefited.

    Harvey, if the condo owners start blockading things, its doubtful they’ll be arrested in mass. First we don’t have enough jail cells. Two, many of those who they want to have do the arresting may be in the same situation as the protestors. We’ll see how the condo insurance thing shakes out. Will government step in to help them or abandon them like the Indigenous people historically were. I do believe though, that the insurance “issue” will be dealt with to the benefit of owners before they clean up Grassy Narrows.

    This has been fun, but I’ve go to rush off to a 65th birthday party. now I wonder on a % basis how many Indigenous people get to that age and how many of European descent, Asian descent, etc. It isn’t just about the pipeline, its about everything which has transpired to this date.

    (Response: I’d bet MANY of the condo owners blocking any bridge and refusing to budge WOULD be ARRESTED, CHARGED, HAVE TO PAY FOR THEIR OWN LAWYERS (unlike the anarchists, agitators and hereditary obstructionists …who I’m sure have OTHERS footing the bills for their “sacred” battle) , likely BE FINED LARGE AMOUNTS and if they went back to the blockades, YES … be jailed by the judges for contempt of court. And certainly not be rewarded by governments …caving in to their demands. h.o)

  48. Leila Paul says:

    The hereditary matriarch, Rita George, sounds the alarm: “we are being bullied”.

    She’s referring to “outside activists who have embedded themselves in the protest camp” She describes them as “outside protesters who are pursuing their own policy goals”

    Who are they? And what is their true agenda?
    __________________________

    https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/british-columbia/article-thats-not-the-way-of-our-ancestors-wetsuweten-matriarch-speaks/

    ‘That’s not the way of our ancestors’: Wet’suwet’en matriarch speaks out about pipeline conflict.

    “The world thinks the matriarchs are behind all the protests going on and that’s not true. None of the matriarchs were contacted.”
    ….
    Rita George also said Thursday that she and other matriarchs have been feeling sick about the conflict and how it has split their community. She said the opposing hereditary chiefs and some of the people around them – including outside activists who have embedded themselves in the protest camp – have disrespected ancient feast-house traditions of how to treat one another.

    Ms. George said the current influx of outside protesters who are pursuing their own policy goals has put a damper on the exchange of opinions inside the community. Instead, she said even the elders are afraid to voice their concerns.

    “I want the world to know what’s been happening to us. We are being bullied, it’s so shameful, so hurtful. We are being humiliated.”
    ….

    “It hurts me to see them [pipeline opponents] wearing regalia in the snow and mud and marching in the cities. That’s not right. That’s affecting all of us. Our ancestors would say they are dirtying the names and the regalia.”

  49. BMCQ says:

    (Edited…getting way off topic.)

    Canada has far too many Radical Indigenous People Kind, Anarchists, Terrorists, Law Breakers of many types, along with PC SJW Spineless Politicians likevPM Justin, his Minions, NDP Singh, , weak Kneed RCMP and Civic Police, Activist Mayors and Councils, a Two Faced Hypocritical NDP Premier like Horgan and his Minions, does that cover it all .

    Time for at least a Symbolic Vote of Non Confidence in Ottawa .

    God I Hate Tokenism and Symbolism, it makes me think about Canadian PM Justin and in turn it makes me sick to my stomach .

  50. Harry Lawson says:

    Harvey

    how do we resolve this mess before some one is killed
    ?
    Are we as a society going to hold toys generation at fault for injustices of prevous generations ? i would hope not

    we need leadership from all parties , all levels of government .

    i would urge a series of summits that would bring all together , out of those summits will come a definition and roadmap to what is reconciliation i would urge that governance such as the the indian act is chucked , this will all take several years and a lot of pain . we may have to amend the constitution ,we may have to change some institutions and governance ,

    if we dont Canada as we know it is gone.

    (Response: The solution is in your comment: LEADERSHIP. We have none …at the municipal, provincial, federal or even Court levels right now … not even with our park board! All of them spineless … afraid to enforce any laws … just issue paperwork that is ignored … unwilling to uphold the laws … and even their own oaths of office. So the occupiers, anarchists, agitators, eco-terrorists are being allowed to interfere with thousands of Canadians’ rights, shut down industries and impact jobs, and wreck the economy. We need to put people in power …left or right …who will PROMISE to work for the MAJORITY and OBEY and ENFORCE the laws … not cater to and cave in to the radicals …whose demands and actions will only get worse unless they are confronted… and stopped. h.o.)

  51. Leila Paul says:

    Reconciliation?

    There’s an absurdity in the word when it’s being used at a time that emotions are inflamed and blockaders appear to welcome, might even be hoping for and provoking, a violent confrontation. 

    No loyal Canadian can be happy about the description of negotiating “nation to nation”. It’s a tacit admission that we are not and may never have been a united country.

    But we must deal within the exisitng reality. Natives and non-Natives are all part of our country. If violence erupts, all our dreams and the future of our youth are at risk.

    Laws and legislation cannot impose peace. Laws provide a framework that enables an orderly society when all parties within a nation want peace.

    The other concern that’s been keeping me awake is what of the statements made by hereditary chief and matriarch Rita George? It sounds to me as though the Women’s Council she was part of has indeed been usurped by the outside provocateurs she appears to be describing in that G&M article.

    If her statements are accurate, I can’t help but ask: are some of the Wet?suwet?en hereditary matriarchs being held almost in a state of hostage?

    Were they pushed out of their positions because they were willing to cooperate with the provincial government? Were those who are filled with animosity and bitterness so enraged against the women’s council that approved the pipeline that they forcibly stripped them of their traditional legitimate titles?

    If so, then shouldn’t this being investigated?

    Are we, in a sense, all being held hostage by this crisis; seemingly paralyzed as we wait for the blockades to come down and the riots to cease? These outside instigators appear to be exploiting and manipulating the grievances of the native tribes.

    Do we have an obligation to determine if the peace seekers among the native leaders are being intimated, and possibly being held in a form of imposed silence, or hostage.

    Are those who want peaceful coexistence being silenced or stripped of their rightful powers? If so, this affect us too in a very grave way.

    Does either level of government have the authority to determine if those leading the riots and blockades are indeed in power by the tribes’ own legitimate traditions?

    If the hereditary matriarchs and other male hereditary leaders and elders are being intimidated into silence, then they must be restored to their rightful roles and be allowed to speak for their membership.

    But that cannot occur if violence erupts. Rita George may have given the government and RCMP a path to resolve this quickly – before it’s too late and violence erupts.

    If Ms. George’s claims are accurate, then she and her allies must be protected, brought out to speak for their people and restored to their rightful roles.

    Until then, we must avoid violence. Allowing Rita George and the other hereditary leaders who want the pipeline and oppose the blockades to have a public venue to speak could be done within a few days.

    They could disarm this entire confrontation if they’re given the platform that should have been theirs from the start, if not for the outside agitators which Ms. George describes.

    The alternatives are unthinkable and must be prevented. Meanwhile these rightful hereditary peace-seeking elders, matriarchs or men, may need us to (in a sense) rescue them.

    If they’re being intimidated and silenced, they must be restored to their leadership roles. And we cannot stand by idly while they’re deprived of their freedoms to exercise peaceful leadership.

  52. frozentundra says:

    Whoever is running the strategy on this is brilliant!

    Continual protests to ruin the economy, frivolous lawsuits to slowly drag the company down, reduce the probability of the project and sap the will of the proponent. And when these lawsuits go against the strategy, refuse to acknowledge it and bring in your own interpretation of the law to justify continued resistance.
    Now the chiefs are playing a game of hard to get, hard to find, refusing to meet the government until demands are met and when those demands are met, asking for more before they will have a meeting and zipping away on junkets across the continent because they know the government is desperate for a deal and will sell their soul to get one.

    If this is a dress rehearsal for TMX, they are doing a wonderful job. The way it looks from my angle now is that the government will capitulate on both projects eventually and there will not be another major resource project done again in Canada. From what I am seeing, the end result will be that by the end of this a $40 billion dollar project will be sacrificed to make sure Quebec gets propane and the subsequent $20 billion Frontier project and the $12 billion TMX will be cancelled as Trudeau will not want to go through this again, especially with his prized UN Security Council seat at risk.

    (Response: Just imagine how all this, on top of previous horrendous handling/reactions/opposition/obstacles/rejections of resource projects is hurting future investment in Canada! Who would ever choose Canada First, Second or even Third for a project if there are other more friendly alternatives … and yes, even environmentally caring and active … but not hostile countries? It’s easy for the activists, anarchists, eco-terrorists and their ally radical left-wing politicians to pooh-pooh the losses … but those projects can and do provide BILLIONS of dollars to fund those great programs we all want expanded! h.o)

  53. 13 says:

    So our PM has made it crystal clear. I wonder if he has a plan as to what consequences
    will occur when no one responds to his “threat”. Its hard to define his statement as a threat, perhaps a plea would be more appropriate.
    So now we can add to pompous preening etc gasbag, windbag. I suppose we will need to wait and see before labeling him a blowhard. So find a good book, settle in as spring is coming, then summer. Yes indeed Trudeau has laid down the ….law?

  54. D. M. Johnston says:

    A few more days later, Global TV is reporting “Wet’suwet’en solidarity protesters set up new Vancouver rail blockade, violating injunction”.

    So where are our cowardly politicians?

    The mayor of Vancouver?

    AWOL

    Horgan?

    AWOL

    Trudeau?

    AWOL

    It is how the country is governed. The anarchists know they have politicians by the “short and curlies” with a grip that would not let go.

    Countries are not built by cowards!

    If you or I did this to protest our cause, I would wager that a few minutes would pass before being told to leave or be arrested.

    I despair, hoe the law treats people, the crush those who have no political say, but runs and hides the first minute first nations are mentioned.

    From personal experience, the Law is an Ass.

    From Charles Dickens:

    “It was all Mrs. Bumble. She would do it,” urged Mr. Bumble; first looking round, to ascertain that his partner had left the room.

    That is no excuse,” returned Mr. Brownlow. “You were present on the occasion of the destruction of these trinkets, and, indeed, are the more guilty of the two, in the eye of the law; for the law supposes that your wife acts under your direction.”

    If the law supposes that,” said Mr. Bumble, squeezing his hat emphatically in both hands, “the law is a ass — a idiot. If that’s the eye of the law, the law is a bachelor; and the worst I wish the law is, that his eye may be opened by experience — by experience.”

  55. Leila Paul says:

    The comments by frozentundra identify a theme that is at play in this latest first nations rebellion.

    One cannot cure a disease or a solve a problem unless its cause is correctly identified. With so much at stake for Canada, we must consider all possibilities.

    I’ve encountered provocateurs who openly acknowledged they were Maxist-Leninist, trained initially in Russia decades ago under the Soviet regime. They have spawned subsequent generations who may be less rabid, but nonetheless – a threat.

    When I encountered them and condemned their ideology, I was derogatorily called a “petite bourgeoisie”.

    I won’t go into detail as it will be off topic. But I cannot help but wonder if I see the fingerprints of Marxism-Lenism in the instigators of this first nations rebellion. Marxist-Leninist goals have always been to disrupt and particularly to destroy the economy of a country it has targeted. Ultimately, that weakens the governments and policing agencies.

    Efforts are aimed at discouraging investment; discouraging tourism by appearing to present a threat to law and order; and even to incite armed rebellions. Most of all, it strikes fear in the residents of the country. That is terrorism.

    Remember the FLQ in Quebec? Front de libération du Québec. Those same words have been used in Spanish by the terrorists who instigated civil wars that killed untold numbers in central and south America.

    Along with the words in their names such as Front or Liberation – they also employ words such as People’s – United – Democratic – the Opening – the Light, and other seemingly noble labels.

    In today’s movements, they’ve added the appealing moniker of “social justice warriors”. This appeals to people with genuine sympathy for the underprivileged. It silences opposition.

    Those who attempt to destroy countries find disaffected groups with grievances, and manipulate them through skillful tactics they’ve been trained to employ.

    They attempted, and occasionally succeeded to some extent. They should be easily recognized by security professionals who advise governments. Their tactics can be observed once they’ve been able to accumulate a group to rebel and cause chaos.

    Once they’ve identified groups vulnerable to their manipulation, they depose or dispose of respected leaders who might discourage rebellious and riotous behaviors. They call them appeasers or accuse them of being bribed by the “capitalists” and “imperialists, colonialists”.

    The Marxist-Leninist groups I studied were usually divided into wings, primarily, the “military wing” or the “political wing”.

    The political wing devises the strategy and tactics, while the military instigators plant themselves within the mobs they create who have been persuaded their protests are of their own volition and based on justifiable grievances..

    Their presence in north America has been more subdued than elsewhere, but they have been and remain present in north America.

    With so much at stake for all Canadians we must not hesitate to consider all possibilities, including the most reprehensible. Is this latest first nations’ rebellion part of manipulating them to succeed as the front for the true provocateurs in their ongoing goal to overthrow ‘capitalists, imperialists, and colonialists’?

    In Canada today, the most vulnerable groups to such incitement and manipulation are the first nations peoples. Those among them who favour peace and stability are simply pushed aside and silenced.

    Fabian socialism usually precedes and perhaps lays the groundwork to prepare for militant Marxist-Leninist inspired rebellions.

    The FLQ disastrously misjudged Pierre Trudeau whose ambitions had by then found a home in Parliament as PM. He decisively – and perhaps too forcefully – prevented the FLQ from achieving a goal he seemed to sympathize with in his youth. But PET had matured and was clearly aware of the risks presented by the FLQ.

    I may be completely wrong. But whatever name or ideology is at work, there can be no doubt the ultimate effect will be to undermine our capitalist and democratic systems.

    The first response might be to find the rightful traditional hereditary elders who may have been deposed in order to replace them with those sympathetic to harming Canada’s economy and its global credibility.

    No matter how this is resolved, we must identify the instigators. As commenters have mentioned, investments will surely fail to come to an unstable country.

  56. e.a.f. says:

    we may refer to some people as terrorists and radicals, etc. but some of us in our younger days, espoused positions, which were at the time radical. My take on things, one person’s terrorist is another persons freedom fighter or one person’s freedom fighter is another person’s terrorist.

    Nothing has ever come easily for those at the bottom of the power scale. To attain what they want and need usually means “rebellion” “terrorism”, etc. No one gives up power willingly. They don’t want to share it, they want to do what benefits them and theirs. In my opinion, that is what we have going on now. Its just nice for the middle class to be able to describe it as a violation of our laws.

    The purpose of these protests is to inconvenience society. To make sure people pay attention. That is why we protest. Some people argue this is all unlawful, but when the law fails you, then what else can you do.

    Norm Farrell’s articles on the pipe line are interesting in that they lead to me conclude they aren’t economically viable or not going to make enough money to justify the problems they are creating. For some here, who argue the rule of law, etc there are others who might argue, its costing too much money. why even go through all of this “shit” for something which isn’t going to make money hand over fist. Is this just about re directed anger and re directed power and control. If for e.g., the Indigenous protestors were to win, how ever that happens, where would that leave the gas and oil corporations? In my opinion, non of this is about law and order and radicals and terrorists, its about power and control. It’s about corporations getting to do what they want to do, no matter the cost. Its been the history of this country for over a hundred years.

    With our tax dollars subsidizing the oil/gas industry to the tune of $4.3 billion a year. That needs to stop. If any one is going to get $4.3 billion a year to run their companies, they need to find another line of work. If they can’t make it without $4.3 billion in subsidies, they aren’t viable. Implement a prescription plan for Canada instead. it would be much more beneficial to Canadian society.

    To some of you who may not have been involved in things which resulted in court injunctions to try to get you to stop doing what you were doing, sometimes the participants just don’t care. they think they are doing the right and proper thing.

    As the government moves forward, things need to be done very, very carefully. Who ever dies because of these actions, which includes those who encourage it, are all complicit in my opinion, in the death. It is interesting once the first person has been killed people just don’t seem to understand they helped things get “that far” and someone died. No one person’s death is worth that. How many lives is the pipe line worth?

  57. Leila Paul says:

    eaf – When you write “It is interesting once the first person has been killed people just don’t seem to understand THEY helped things get “that far” and someone died. No one person’s death is worth that. How many lives is the pipe line worth?” (uppercase is my stress) I must ask:

    Who are you referring to as “THEY” that are responsible if the first person is killed. Do you mean all of those who objected because the blockades and riots put their and their families’ economic livelihood at risk?

    Am I to understand that demanding that lawful protests remain peaceful, non-threatening, orderly and in the sites or places about which the protest is occurring. Are you saying those reasonable expectations means that those people are responsible for any deaths that occur in attempting to protect the national economy, and all people reliant upon it?

    Any deaths will not be caused by the aggressive, challenging provocatins of the rioters themselves? Is that what you’re saying?

    People who make reasonable requests that keep a society from mayhem and civil wars are, from the way I read your last paragraph, are the ones responsible when such a death occurs? Such a potential death is not the responsibility of those who incite and foment violence as the illegal protests are doing?

    I again state my observations: it is not the pipelines that are rising up and slinking above ground lashing out at people or intentionally leaking and spurting gas on the environment. The pipelines create jobs within the suffering first nations communities with which you appear to be so sympathetic.

    The first nations leaders who approved the pipeline are in a far better position to know what their youth and their unemployed members need.

    Let’s stop using euphemisms and fantasy imagery. It is the indigenous people of the nations where the pipeline is being laid that will also get jobs from it. First nations are among those who will benefit from the employment that construction of the pipeline and maintenance of the pipeline create. That is why the deposed leaders of the first nation most affected have been in favour of and support the pipeline.

    I do not think I comprehend your willingness to put any life at risk, nor to put our entire economy at risk, so blithely.

    You appear to be an intelligent person who’s capable of recognizing that without laws being willingly obeyed, consequences cannot be predicted nor controlled.

    Yet you believe that human populations must not alter their environment in order to create life-sustaining employment.

    As for saving the planet – are we as a species so completely arrogant that we believe the planet is a helpless entity being abused by us like an animal chained and being doused with pollutants?

    This planet has unknown restorative abilities that alter as alterations require.

    This planet can shake off its human inhabitants if we go too far and become a pestilence. I visualize a dog shaking off fleas.

    I’ve marveled at how a horse, that I’m grooming, has the ability to ripple its skin and shake off a horsefly before its bitten him while it then lands on me and I’m unable to simply shake it off.

    Our knowledge of this planet is a pittance in understanding how it functions. When and if “mother earth” decides we’ve gone too far, it will respond from its intrinsic powers that are way out of our abilities to know.

    But you think the planet needs us to riot against and risk killing one another in order to protect it. Within this massive and unknowable cosmos, you seem to believe humanity is so evil and we are supremely capable of either destroying or saving the planet. It rotates and sails through through the cosmos but is yet utterly helpless in combating or restoring itself from our activities.

    How do you propose jobs are to be created for first nations – or any of our unemployed people – without altering our environment?

    Please, just tell me who “they” are that will be responsible for any deaths. Then, please also tell me how jobs and necessary fuels for our survival can be created without altering the environment?

    This is not a challenge, eaf, but truly respectful questions. I await your response.

    (Response: You raise an interesting point about where do people expect First Nations to get jobs .. if not related to resource developments. Exactly! I have seen First Nations poverty first hand on many occasions: and let’s keep it real … resource development jobs, pipelines and royalties could hold a major key to uplifting many rural area First Nations communities. The truth is the anarchists, activists and eco-terrorists couldn’t really care less about First Nations peoples…. it’s their own agendas they are pursuing. Sad to see First Nations people being used by these urban warriors and so many not realizing how they are being played. h.o.)

  58. Leila Paul says:

    Norm Farrell is quoted as an authoritative source by eaf.

    With all due respect to Mr. Farrell, I am only describing my first impressions.

    I looked at his website and see no biography revealing any unique or even unusual abilities to know what is TRULY going on inside government financial projections and reports.

    (Edited…off topic … which is the blockades and govmt responses .. or lack thereof)

    Sorry, eaf, but your financial acumen may not be as accurate as you portray. In fact, IMO, your litany of how much money we, the taxpayers, are being cheated of reads more like a mantra. A screed would be a good description. Or perhaps almost a dogma or doctrine. Numbers so massive (although minimal in today’s global economy) are quoted as though they are bits of fuel added to a fire to enrage burdened taxpayers.

    (Edited…off topic)

    Meanwhile, I’d still like to know your answers regarding who you believe would be the instigators of the “first death”. I’d also like to know how you expect to provide essentials for so many human lives without altering our environment.

  59. Leila Paul says:

    A last comment on this topic.

    I hope my private pension’s investments are mostly (even hopefully entirely) outside Canada.

    I believe this interview in on topic:

    https://nationalpost.com/news/canadians-want-an-end-to-the-blockades-support-police-intervention-poll-finds

    (Edited..off topic)

    Amid the global downturn, Canada is sending signals do not invest in us.

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