Premier John Horgan Should Apologize to British Columbians

There are more than 700 BC families and hundreds of their relatives and friends now in mourning and planning funerals for victims of BC’s recent brutal heat wave.

BC’s Coroner Service says that’s TRIPLE the normal number of sudden deaths recorded at this time of the year.

And no amount of government excuses or spin will change the truth: many of those could still be alive if Premier John Horgan and his NDP government had kept their 2017 election promise to “invest in more paramedics, so that no one is left waiting for an ambulance in their time of critical need.” 

No doubt that is a broken vow … four years later, still not only substantially unfulfilled, but a situation getting even worse.

But that is not why I am calling on Horgan to apologize.

Governments … all governments … fail to keep promises: and if leaders had to apologize each time they did, there would be daily announcements of lists of regrets.

But where Horgan fell short this week went beyond the pale … even for a politician.

““I’ll await the coroner’s determination. As Dr. (Bonnie) Henry said, fatalities are part of life,” the Premier told reporters Tuesday. 

“The public was acutely aware that we had a heat problem, but it was apparent to anyone who walked outdoors that we were in an unprecedented heat wave and again there’s a level of personal responsibility.”

Oh … so it was the “responsibility” of people who had heat strokes, suffered accidents etc, and lay there on their beds or floors for hours waiting for ambulances that never came to take care of themselves!

I don’t recall reading THAT in the NDP’s Election Platform … in 2017 or in 2020!

Imagine so many BC families hearing that from BC’s Premier as they are immersed in grief, arranging to bury their dead, arranging funerals, buying caskets or urns, burial plots.

Their elderly, sick heat victims should have taken better care of themselves. Or their surviving family or friends should have done better. Don’t blame the government.

Remember, statistically, there’s a pretty good chance that many of those who died, and their friends and relations, had believed in Horgan and the NDP, had voted for them … and had done their very BEST for the past year and a half to follow all the government’s guidelines, orders and appeals in the fight against Covid.

But, they … like millions of other British Columbians without air conditioning or alternatives … were largely powerless against the brutal record heat that suffocated the province for days, taking a terrible toll on the elderly, frail and sick.

Emergency 911, first responders, police, fire and paramedics were so overwhelmed … and understaffed … they couldn’t even get to some of those dying at all!

And Horgan’s response…

“We were doing our best to break through all of the other noise to encourage people to take steps to protect themselves,” was Horgan’s message.

Ahh… protect yourself.

It’s YOUR fault … especially those of you in your 70s, 80s, 90s … for collapsing, getting sick and needing help from OTHERS when the province was so overwhelmed!

What a horrible reaction from a “leader” when BC is in the midst of a crisis.

Now I know Horgan is a very intense, competitive … and some say ill-tempered … political being.

However, a Premier MUST be capable of differentiating between his political opponents, pestering media, badgering bloggers … and those who are ordinary taxpayers …citizens who LOOK to their Premier for leadership, support … and sympathy during tough times.

Horgan let them down.

And even after Horgan’s remarks hit the fan, the Premier’s response wasn’t much better.

“Nothing can ease the pain of losing a loved one, whether it’s from the unprecedented heat wave or any other cause. Mourning families deserve our compassion, and the wording of my comments didn’t reflect that. Please continue supporting one another & checking on your neighbours,” he tweeted.”

Notice: NO apology for his FAILURE to show/express any REAL sympathy, compassion, understanding.

Horgan’s response is just not good enough.

If he won’t … or can’t … bring himself to admit he was way off track with his remarks, that will reveal a character flaw and forever become part of his permanent political and personal legacy.

Like P.E. Trudeau’s giving the finger to hurting British Columbians in 1982.

Premier Horgan should say “I apologize” OR “I’m sorry” to those people who suffered or lost loved ones during BC’s heat epidemic, when the government services/help they desperately needed did not come.

And are still suffering and grieving.

And to ordinary British Columbians who believed he and his NDP government would solve BC’s paramedic response crisis … but are still being let down, and paying with their lives.

Harv Oberfeld

(Reminder: Follow @harveyoberfeld on Twitter for FREE First Alerts to new postings on this Blog.)

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33 Responses to Premier John Horgan Should Apologize to British Columbians

  1. Steve Cooley says:

    A couple of days ago I read a headline reporting long waits for ambulances, very long waits in the city. The city being named was/is Edmonton.

    In our province anyone tuned into current affairs has heard at least one horror story about our ambulance service in greater Vancouver. My perspective on this, using a gauche expression, dates to the late 70’s when became involved as a part time paramedic. In those days there were many Indians and a few Chiefs. 25 years later when I retired there many Chiefs and few Indians. In the 20 years since I retired there are many more Chiefs and a few more Indians.

    Both management and union were dominated by those, from my point of view in Vanderhoof, by those beyond Hope. Bill Bennett entrenched many Scrooges in the upper levels of the civil service including BCEHS and the NDP’s biggest failure was not purging them.

    (Response: Certainly does seem to be a management problem: inadequate long-term planning, not enough hiring/training; too low “on call” compensation. But remember, the NDP knew about this in 2017 … and included in their 2017 Election Platform a PROMISE to solve the problems. That was four years ago … and well before this past week’s exceptional circumstances, BC’s ambulance service levels were still inadequate … to the point of being dangerous. h.o)

  2. D. M. Johnston says:

    Horgan should apologize, but apologies in Canada today have been cheapened by Trudeau the Younger, and now has become a cliche, ranking with “thoughts and prayers”‘

    It seems that Horgan’s big ambition was to win an election, well he did last October and ever since, the government has been on autopilot.

    I have my own beef with Horrible Horgan and it taints my view, but the word I get from those who are NDP, but not NDP acolytes would like to see the back of him.

    It is time for Horgan to depart, as he has sat here far too long for what good he has done.

    (Response: He’s not the quitting type …until HE’S good and ready to go. But the NDP BC government is being embarrassed well beyond the local news or this blog. This from overseas: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/john-horgan-canada-heatwave-deaths-b1876311.html. h.o)

  3. r says:

    We need proactive ,ahead of the curve, murphys law governance
    not reactive .
    Fairy creek and LNG and site C were the priority ?
    He ran the victory lap and into the abyss of BC Heat/fire?
    Nero

  4. r says:

    Also Horgan and Trudeau should get off the BC fentanyl death hamster wheel and try something different

  5. Nonconfidencevote says:

    @ r
    Re; The fentanyl hamster wheel”

    +++

    Total agreement.
    Its no secret the death rate from over doses has been climbing for 7 YEARS.
    Throw in Covid deaths and then an unprecedented heat wave causing even more deaths over a weekend.
    A weekend where BC Ambulance staff are refusing OT, calling in sick, off on stress leave, etc etc etc.
    Disaster.

    Horgan is merely another political player in a long line of bureaucrats that have learned to :
    a) admit no guilt.
    b) admit no wrong.
    c) never personally apologize.
    d)Promise to “do something”.
    e) do nothing.

    One can only imagine how bad it will get if Covid Delta or some other virus rears its ugly head and we have an earthquake or heat wave along with the never ending fentanyl extermination event.

  6. Gilbert says:

    Premier Horgan strikes me as a very arrogant and cold person. Unlike Justin Trudeau, he’s not a very good actor. The irony is that Andrew Wilkinson was supposedly cold and uncaring.

    If John Horgan had made his disgraceful comments before election day, the result could have been very different. Voters need to remember his comments. Let’s make sure he doesn’t win another term.

    (Response: You’re absolutely right: those remarks made before an election would hurt any politician. But Horgan should not think this will be forgotten …by either the voters nor the Liberals. He should apologize now ..or he will wear it forever. h.o)

  7. e.a.f. says:

    Well so much for self . reliance. Half the time we hear people complaining people aren’t being responsible enough for themselves and then when they’re not, its Horgan’s fault. One could also say its the fault of building codes, condo builders and building owners for not adequately insulating buildings or building them with air conditioning. Not every one who died, died in an old building

    One could also ask where were their families, friends, and neighbours. People seem to do a lot of crying, scream, protesting about animals and trees, but their human neighbours, they can’t even be bothered to check up on them.

    Seniors dying in masses is not new. It is in B.C. but in France a number of years ago over 12,ooo died due to heat in Paris. Their relatives went on vacation and the parental units were left on their own. Can’t say it was the result of a lack of health care in France. People were going to die in this heat, whether we were short of paramedics or not.

    On to the lack of paramedics, yes Horgan and the NDP have had enough time to fix the problem and it ought to have been fixed. We have had a shortage of paramedics through not only the B.C. Lieberals and NDP, but the Socreds, No government seems keen to spend the money and that is what it is going to take money and re organization. As an earlier commenter suggested, a lot of people need to be fired for not doing their jobs at the management level. As the old saying goes, they couldn’t organize a screw in a whore house.

    as people age they frequently drink less fluids to stay hydrated. we as a society need to educate people to take care of themselves. It wouldn’t have hurt for radio and t.v. stations to carry reminders to drink enough water or tea to stay hydrated. advise on how much to drink might have helped also. Its easy to forget to drink enough when its this hot and the next thing you know you’re in trouble. I know. I’m one of those who doesn’t drink enough and have to really work at drinking enough fluids to stay hydrated.
    Many people don’t know putting your feet in a bowl of cool water helps, or putting a wet cold towel around your neck. Opening windows when its hot doesn’t help, just lets in more hot air and some times its hotter than inside. Before we had air conditioners or fans in homes, lots of people from the prairies used to put a wet towel in the freezer or fridge, then hang it in a window once the breeze did come up, cools the room down.

    This is the result of climate change and people are going to die from it. In the meantime we’re complaining about the high cost of gas, pipelines being built, and we’re still shipping American coal via the Delta Port which American ports won’t ship out. Its too toxic for the enviornment. We will have to make a decision about how we live, but first we might want to start by checking in with neighbours and re structuring the ambulance service.

    (Response: Most people don’t call ambulances to just check on neighbours, to give them a drink of water or perform the normal “self reliance” needs. When people have a stroke or heart attack or fall and crack open their head, they NEED an ambulance. And in a city/province like BC … where there are MILLIONS for bike lanes, HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS to buy up hotels and provide free housing to thousands from across the province/country …. citizens should be able to get an ambulance and emergency care within minutes when it’s crucial. More than 700 people died from sudden death in a week … TRIPLE the normal rate… because ambulances were NOT available… not because neighbours failed to check on them. So your attempt to get Horgan off the hook on that “self reliant” excuse falls flat. And how he handled the matter afterwards made it all even worse! He should apologize. h.o)

  8. SG says:

    I remember a time when anyone with a level 3 Industrial First Aid ticket could join the BC ambulance service, the BC ambulance service would then pay for you to upgrade your first aid training to that of a paramedic… The Gordon Campbell Liberals scrapped that program as a cost savings measure, under the Campbell Liberals you had to have completed the full paramedic training at your own expense, at many thousands of dollars, before you could be hired by the BC ambulance service. The Clark Liberals kept that measure in place, and now so have the Horgan NDP… The fact is that it’s far too expensive for the average individual to complete all the necessary paramedic training at their own expense, and then be hired by the BC ambulance service on an on call basis at $2:00 per hour. In rural BC there are very few full time BC ambulance personnel, most paramedics working for the BC ambulance service are part time employees, usually as a second job. Unless the government goes back to the old days when they provided training to anyone wanting to be a part time paramedic, things are only going to get worse.
    ETA: In the good old days if you joined the BC ambulance service, the BC ambulance service would also pay for you to upgrade your drivers license so you could drive the ambulance, now you must already have an upgraded drivers license before they will hire you..
    Keep in mind that most BC ambulance paramedics in rural BC are part time on-call employees for a great number of years before they can apply for full time postings in major urban areas, where the stand to actually make a living at being a paramedic.

  9. e.a.f. says:

    As to an apology, when I was a kid a famous conductor and soprano had come to Vancouver for a Vancouver Opera Association event. I was present watching the rehearsal while our father sang with the chorus in the opera. The soprano made an error, stopped and apologized. The Conductor, looked at her, and said, don’t be sorry, do it right. I’ve never forgotten that incident.
    I don’t need Horgan or any one to apologize. I want them to do it right. An adequate ambulance /paramedic service is required in this province, every where in this province.

  10. Tim says:

    Horgan’s comments adds to an ever growing list of attributes that will ensure whomever wins the BC Liberal horserace, will become Premier in 2024 and ensure the NDP is again sidelined for another couple of decades. He had a golden opportunity to shift that but with each robotic public appearance and asinine comment, he is pissing it all away. Too bad, I liked him up until the end of last October’s election.

    (Response: It’s certainly not going to help him. I can already visualize that clip appearing in future Liberal campaign aids … and assuming we are in for more heat waves, more deaths, and more ambulance problems ahead … Horgan’s attempt to seemingly blame the “victims” could no doubt come back to haunt …unless he clears the air with a SINCERE apology. But I’m not sure he’s capable of doing that. h.o)

  11. daniel says:

    On one hand there is a prime minister that is ready to apologize for anything and everything under the sun and then we have a premiere who doesn’t even seem to know how to apologize. Good grief. What in the hell is wrong with you John Horgan? Why do you continue to do this? Are you not embarrassed that you continually have to backtrack all the time. I don’t get it.
    I believe it was on July 1st that Jordan Armstrong from Global TV interviewed Darlene Mackinnon, head of the BC Health Emergency Services. She said all the right words with all the right platitudes, but as far as I could see by the way she expressed herself, there was no sincerity or empathy at all for those poor people and their friends and families. Maybe that was just my take.
    Ugh.

    (Response: Yes, Trudeau may be too free with his apologies: they have begun to lose both credibility and impact. Horgan, however, needs to be learn how to tell the difference between “caving in” and sincerely just admitting he was wrong. Clearly still a work in progress … that he should complete this week. h.o)

  12. Nonconfidencevote says:

    @ daniel
    ” I believe it was on July 1st that Jordan Armstrong from Global TV interviewed Darlene Mackinnon, head of the BC Health Emergency Services. She said all the right words with all the right platitudes, but as far as I could see by the way she expressed herself, there was no sincerity or empathy at all for those poor people and their friends and families. Maybe that was just my take.”

    +++

    Ahhh Yes….. the “canned speech” script delivered with all the empathy of a cold toaster.
    Seems most bureaucrats have that speech down pat no matter what event.

    A child dies in Social Services,
    ” We cant go into personal details in order to protect the family’s privacy”
    Now we have three times the normal death rate because THERE WERE NO AMBULANCES AVAILABLE”

    But no one raises the Fentanyl issue.
    Drug addicts overdosing 1, 2 maybe 3 times in one night and it ties up valuable resources.
    Free expensive Narcan Kits?….Pfft…. call 911.
    Taxpayers are dying so that we can feel good about ourselves when we revive drug addicts that cost our system millions in police, medical, court, and rehab….. so that they can do it all over again.
    They take and take and take from the social programs and give nothing back. Nothing.
    Time to triage.
    On busy 911 nights.
    Put the OD calls at the back of the line for taxpayers who have worked their entire lives and probably have used the ambulance service rarely if ever.
    Darwin’s Law will take care of the rest.

    (Response: Someone in the working media should perhaps check how many ambulances were ..and are … stationed in an close to the downtown eastside because of the large number of drug calls? It would be an eye-opening story if many of those who died sudden deaths from heat stroke, heart attacks, seizures or accidents were lost because there were few/no ambulances in other areas of the city … because most were deployed in the downtown to handle drug calls. Political decisions … influenced by City Hall or Provincial pressures??? h.o)

  13. RIsaak says:

    Shortage of medical first responders, some chaos between FD’s & Paramedics (about who should catch calls, been an issue for years), still unresolved from what I’ve read.

    State of emergency, seemingly endless in regards to covid, seemingly useless in fire season? The NDP claim the bureaucrats are saying not yet, cough, cough, cough, I guess the dark red sun, ashes falling & many fuel laden interface zones (see Filmon report for clues on this omission), still seeing a government fast to offload responsibility to their underlings while Rome (interior) burns?

    I guess I’m just an older guy wishing the past days of accountability and foresight would make an appearance once & awhile.

    (Response: The days of politicians resigning or temporarily stepping because they have been found to be violating principles, ethics, standards seem to be long gone! Unless of course polls show they have become a liability! h.o)

  14. r says:

    And so should Trudeau ..but vaccine election soon?
    No reviews of fire/heat protocols announced Canada or BC?

  15. Stu de Baker says:

    Horgan has always been known for putting his mouth in motion before his mind is in gear. After all these years, you’d think he would have learned. He’s just not woke yet.

    Trouble is, BC and all most provinces, Canada and most countries are led by misfits with nothing better on the bench.

    None of that matters though, because it accomplishes the end game of those who really run things.

    (Response: I think it was Rafe Mair who said a leader doesn’t have to be 10; he (or she) could be a six and still win …if the competition are just three or four. Next provincial election is a long way yet, but if the Libs come up with anything close, or better, his latest gaffe could hurt him and the party. h.o)

  16. e.a.f. says:

    Daniel, I saw the same apology by Darlene Mackinnon and I agree there was no sincerity or empathy. Now some people don’t do well on t.v., but my take was she just didn’t care. given the duties of a CEO are organization,, when it comes to replacing people, they might start with her. She obviously isn’t doing her job.

    Harvey,, I wasn’t suggesting people call ambulances for their neighbours for a check. that is a waste of resources. I was suggesting they themselves could check on their neighbours. It was a suggestion that people learn to look after themselves in the heat so they don’t get heat stroke. Heat stroke is preventable if people look after themselves. Now it is acknowledged seniors are not always aware they are starting to suffer from heat stroke, but in this climate, they need to learn.

    Now as to comments regarding spending of money on homes for the homeless. If the government didn’t there would be more deaths or is there some sort of ranking order of who gets to die and who gets to live. The homeless need places to live and people need ambulances and paraamedics. of course this will all cost money. so how much are we willing to pay for an adequate supply of paramedics in all of our communities.

    Horgan isn’t going to apologize and I don’t care. I want a better ambulance service. As to replacing the NDP with the B. C. Lieberals, give your head a shake or do you forget how the ambulance service got to be this way. Going back to a B.C. Lieberal government is just going to continue with an ambulance service which needs improvement and then all the other fun we had with the B.C. Lieberals, Can any one spell money laundering in B.C. casinos. When you think of going back to the former government remember why we voted them out of office to begin with. Does any one really think the B.C. Lieberals are going to bring us any better government than the NDP has. Remember the 16 yrs of el gordo and then Christie.

    (Response: I know the Liberals cannot count on your support in the next election (LOL!) …but if the Libs can come up with any kind of credible, appealing leader and campaign, Horgan’s coldness, temper (especially if he keeps showing signs) and the gaffe he made could come back to haunt the NDP … mark my words. h.o)

  17. HARRY LAWSON says:

    Harvey,

    Outstanding post

    I will be following the BC Liberal leadership with great interest. I think Horgan has played his swan song on nero’s violin.

    I am thouroly disgusted with both the government response and lack of response.

    I would like to know why a provincial state of emergency was not called ? Why ? Under such a order all provincial buildings could have been opened as cooling centres such a order would have ensured all of BC had acess to public misting stations, bring the feds on board we could have had the resources of the military etc.

    If it was a covid variant all help would break loose shut the province down

    Yet I hear the ambulance service didn’t open their emergency command centre until Tuesday .SUCH a shame .

    Time to change senior management and maybe even ministerial staff this is truly unacceptable and reprehensible.

    (Response: Since getting rid of ambulance waiting times was in the NDP Platform in 2017, because people were suffering and complaining way back then it’s not like this problem suddenly arose in 2021 as an exceptional emergency. But as I said in my piece, politicians breaking promises never surprises me: the big gaffe …totally indefensible … was the cold, nasty way Horgan seemed to be blaming the public … even the victims …for getting sick and needing ambulances. The Premier needs to apologize … and admit it was not British Columbians, but he who got it wrong. h.o)

  18. jay says:

    As a working paramedic I can tell you that upper management knows nothing about how BCEHS works.
    When the ambulance service got lumped into PHSA it was a literal shit show. They had no idea what we did, how we did it or what we needed to do it.
    This latest disaster is a prime example.
    First they failed to declare an emergency, unlike police fire and just about anyone else. They probably did this because the moment they do a lot of thing go into effect that they don’t want.
    Then they failed to adequately staff the ambulances province wide. There are mandatory recall policies available but they cost money so no way they use them.
    And now they have tried to lump the paramedics in with managements lack of response. They have tacitly made it seem like it is the crews that are at fault. I guess they took to many bathroom breaks or didn’t eat and drink fast enough.

    BCEHS needs to be removed from PHSA and put back under the direct supervision of the ministry. There are just too many LR and bean counters trying to run an ambulance service who have zero knowledge of how it works and no desire to fix it.

  19. Nonconfidencevote says:

    @jay
    “There are just too many LR and bean counters trying to run an ambulance service who have zero knowledge of how it works and no desire to fix it.”

    +++

    Sad but true.
    Between the bean counters and Human Resuorces “equality” hiring practices you now have most govt agencies run by inexperienced, unprepared, middle management staffers parachuted in from their last disaster at attempting to manage something.
    Great at parroting what they have memorized at Business School but it doesnt mean anything in the real world.
    Zero knowledge of how a dept works but boy, do they know how to play “buzz word bingo” in their interminable meetings.
    “Empowerment”, “synergies”, ” Wholistic approach”, on and on and on with the same management drivel that has been spewed forth over the last 30 years.
    Different dog, same fleas.
    With 1000 emails back and forth to cover their butt.

    (Response: I believe all the pressure recent events, media coverage and social media outrage has generated has substantially increased attention by the government to the crisis in our ambulance services. Watch for a management shakeup, reorganization and new funding. But what the people also need is a Premier who understands it’s not the public’s fault so many people unnecessarily died in the recent heat crisis … and he should apologize for the hurt he caused by his early remarks.

  20. e.a.f. says:

    Harvey, when I read your comment with Rafe’s line I just loved it and laughed. I actually remember him saying that. He was oh so correct.

    The B.C. Lieberals and my support for them would be a long time coming, but you did make me laugh. Now who could possibily lead that party to cause me to vote for them and how badly would the NDP have to screw up? Something to think about. I’d vote federal Liberal if necessary but the problem is the B.C.Lieberals aren’t Liberals. In my opinion the B.C. LIeberals are just too tainted to govern the province again. I’d have to vote for the Rhino party is they ran some one. I do remember them. It is doubtful the B.C. Lieberals have what it takes to resurface.
    It would be interesting to see if the P.C.s could make a go of it as a political party here. Who knows perhaps they could fix the ambulance service because the Socred, B.C. Lieberals nor NDP have done it today Elections however aren’t always one issue events.

    Shall we regroup on the topic after the next provincial election?

  21. jay says:

    I believe i said it before in a previous blog.

    The way to solve this is easy.

    Get the ambulance service back into the ministry of health.
    Double the budget.
    Make every position full time. Stop using a part time model that relies on people working for $2 an hour.
    Pay paramedics what they are worth. We are currently at least 30% behind police and fire in wages.
    Stop the frivolous calls.
    Recognize and support people who are in crisis. Stop attacking them when you post memorandum that tell them to do something and when they do you freak out and threaten discipline or dismissal.
    Understand that we are human. We need time to eat, drink, excrete and just plain rest.

    Personally I am sick of all the BS that is being directed at our crews. We do the best we can. We fight for every life and we can only do 1 call at a time.
    You have no idea what it is like sitting at the scene of a drunk person when a block away someone is in cardiac arrest, stabbed, shot or some other problem and we can’t go there because we are tied up.
    I have had to deal with minor calls while major calls are going on with no cars available. This is horrible but the only thing I can do is tell myself that I can only do 1 call at a time.

    I apologize to everyone who lost a loved one lately. I was not able to help you due to being off with a PTSD leave. But rest assured, when I return, I will do everything I am able to do to help.

  22. BMCQ says:

    Yes, Premier should apologize but he should mean it when he does so, he needs to ensure that he comes across as caring, considerate, and reflective for his initial cold, uncaring, and callous comments regarding the deaths on record .

    I do not support the NDP but I am not necessarily going to single out Premier Horgan for his arrogance and his off handed remarks, he should be thinking about how he would feel if it was older loved ones of his that perished due to heat and lack of caring and response by various Health Officials and the problems of “First Response ” .

    Arrogant politicians like Horgan, Christy Clark when she lost her last election the current PM just seem to morph into a completely different being once they have power of course not all Premiers and PM’s ae like that but……….

    (Edited…off topic)

    I was willing to give Horgan a chance because of his background and i thought he would be pragmatic and more thoughtful but I was wrong, Carole James may have been a better bet . I honestly do not see James being arrogant or entitled as we see/saw3 with Christy and Horgan .

    Horgan became cold, calculating, and manipulative when he and his handlers chose to all the last election and he basically took advantage of a weakened electorate and he liteally behaved like a “Carpet Bagger” Politician, unscrupulous and deceitful . Shame .

    Then of course Adrian Dix and dr. Bonnie really carried the ball across the line and I do not mean that as a criticism, they were very influential with the electorate and they literally carried the day for Premier Horgan .

    As to the problem with the Responses from Government Health Authorities and on down to First Responders ?

    We have TWO very serious problems .

    The first major problem is the General Public need MORE Education, between people new to B.C. and others not educated by Educators, parents, and Media stories people call Ambulance and paramedics for basically almost trivial things today, people demand Ambulance for broken thumbs, sprains, and so many other things that should be taken care of in clinics or local physicians, if the so called injury may be a little more serious most of us can get to the ER ourselve3s or a family member can assist .
    The Great Unwashed need Educating on this and the local news programs would be a great time to get the point across, on English, French, and other Foreign language News and Information Broadcasts .

    (Edited… off topic.)

    Yes the Premier should bend down on his knee and apologize for his unfortunate comments, it would be better for him and better for his Government, the People of B.C. who have lost loved ones deserve much better .

    I must say I was impressed that Minister Mike Farnworth spoke out against the “Whacked Out” comments made by the BCCLA Association Head for her absolutely horrendous, despicable, and treasonous “Hate Speech” comments she directed at “Church Burnings’ in Canada .

    I salute Mike Farnworth, where is the Premier on this ?

    (Edited…off topic)

    Come on Premier Horgan, you can denounce Walia and apologize for your cold uncaring remarks this very afternoon .

  23. HARRY LAWSON says:

    Harvey,

    Jay, has raised a severl interesting points.

    We need to ‘re think the whole delivery of the ambulance service.

    Change starts from the top down.

    Can we not have a ambulance divisions that monitors lower risk patients , it may be based on the safe ride. model, can we not have the hospital take care of the patients as soon as they arrive I stead of tying up crews for 4 to 8 hours.?

    We are allowing people to did with out fighting chance We are burning out very dedicated workers .

    So shameful.

    (Response: I have no doubt changes are coming: the pressure has really been building up. But none of that gets Horgan off the hook: if he does not apologize for the seeming disdain he directed at BC residents, he and the NDP will “wear” it for a very long time. h.o)

  24. e.a.f. says:

    where Harvey and his commenters lead the press will follow. Interesting all that has been written on this blog regarding the ambulance service. The news last evening caught up and did a fairly decent segment on it, and spoke with the unidentified paramedic who has started a petition to remove the head of the ambulance service. Interesting. Now of course the press could have done better, but given this is B.C. media we can’t expect them to be up to Keep It Real standards.

    (Response: Mike Smyth on NW has done some good stuff on the ambulance crisis …but I’m happy we on here have repeatedly been able to give the growing problems a human dimension fairly early on… going back as far as 2009! http://harveyoberfeld.ca/blog/bc-paramedics-essential-service-victims/ h.o)

  25. Keith says:

    Hi Harvey,

    if this is too far off topic don’t publish it.

    As E.A.F. noted;

    where Harvey and his commenters lead the press will follow

    this has happened more than a few times over the years Harvey that you have been putting out different issues for discussion to my recollection, too many times for it to be a coincidence, not just the media but also the politicos.

    When a politician makes a statement about an issue or an issue under their consideration, much background work has and is still being done. Much of this work is done by policy analysts – or similar who research a particular subject every which way possible and send the results of that research up the food chain. The research is via media, govt. stats., foreign government decisions or similar programmes on a particular issue et al the list goes on, with references from where the information was scoured. Bloggers as well but they probably wouldn’t put that in print.

    The responses from blog commenters will be looked at, the ultra partisan will be briefly read but the more thoughtful comments will be looked at seriously for information and solutions to a problem. If you copy text for an exam it’s called plagiarism, if you copy text for information it’s called research.

    Public statements by the govt. representative will often be a word salad calling a spade an earth inverting horticultural implement, The people who create the background information for the statement are not political hacks looking for a particular slant or outcome, They work in sharp concise factual language, this is what they are used to and if as blog commenters we would like to help move the needle on a particular subject, this is the format that will get their attention.

    (Response: You raise an interesting issue I’m happy to address. Bloggers … most bloggers … who can be very selective in what they choose to write about … even provocative in expressing opinions and are able to stick with things a lot longer than working media, who have so much more to cover, and deal with a flood of new information/stories every day. And bloggers … often social media rebels in a way … don’t have to please/rely/work with particular politicians or bureaucrats so we can push, push, push a topic that riles them all … and raise issues even before the public wake up to what is going on. A favorite example of that for me was the blockading of ALL cars from Stanley Park by the radical left fascistic decisions by the Park Board: I wrote about that SEVERAL times, for months, before the public/handicapped spoke up and the working media finally woke up to how outrageous it all was. Next Monday, I’m planning to raise hell again … about a topic bothering millions of Canadians …but that NO politicians or media have had the guts to take on … unless the blogosphere discussion that follows is great enough they can no longer ignore it. h.o)

  26. BMCQ says:

    e.a.f. – Keith –

    Interesting, insightful and insightful comments !
    The points and opinions you both offer are in my opinion very valid and reflect what Harvey has mentioned several times when he states that this Blog and others are being watched/monitored by many including politicians, staff, and policy makers .

    I know from personal experience that friends and business people I know follow this Blog and some of those are in the UK., Australia, and several in the U.S., I wish I could get some of them to comment but they are satisfied with following by reading . The odd one has posted but not everyone wants to get involved in the give and take .

    You might not be surprised to know that personally I really do not concern myself if the discussions get somewhat heated the odd time, I believe it is healthy . I just do not want posters to attempt to change another posters meaning by interpreting a statement differently then injecting their own version which is an untruth and nothing close to what the original poster meant . Despicable and unacceptable but not surprising when we look at one or two here .

    Harvey –

    Yes to your comments ! I agree with most of your opinions but I must say I enjoy the back and forth and the comments of you and others just as much even when I do not agree, those discussions and the story/acts told are a benefit to all of us and that is how I learn and sometimes evolve on any given issue . Fortunately I have no hesitation to admit if I have been mistaken or changed my mind on a given topic .

    It has been mentioned already but I agree with the comments when I say that I wish and hope that MSM did a better job and I wish they were much more objective, fair, and balanced like our Host, working media people could learn a lot here by following this blog and paying close attention to how a true professional like you carry yourself .

    Todays Media are too politicized, manipulative, complacent, compliant, and too complicit, they are Whores .

    Yes some Media are fair and balanced but not enough of them, but many in Media, their handlers Social Media like Instagram, Wiki, Google, Facebook, Instagram, You Tube and more are Whores for their own Political Masters and in fact hide the truth, they are liars and some are deceitful, they will do anything to protect their Political Masters, just ask Joe/Hunter Biden or PM Justin . The very sad thing in all of this is the fact that about 50% of the Great Unwashed in Canada and the U.S. are unaware of what so many in media are doing to change the truth and the facts into something that supports their political views .

    Of course no one is perfect but you lay it all out here where people can see how you feel on any given subject and you quite often put forward reports, opinions, and ideas before MSM which can in turn attract some criticism and that takes courage . In turn you defend your positions without half truths and manipulation of the facts, working media could learn from that .

    Now if you could only agree with me 100% of the time instead of you only being correct 85% of the time !

    I have said it before and I will repeat it again, thank you for your Wonderful Public Service !

  27. Stu de Baker says:

    Keith;
    “an earth inverting horticultural implement”
    Priceless.

    A very well written piece on the inner workings of power and the influence a blog “could” have.

    When I think of days gone by, when KIR, BC Mary, Sean Holman, and the master, Mr. Mair, would have 40, 50, even 70 comments by almost as many different contributors, I believe it could well have had an impact.

    Now with so few blogs, let alone good ones, with a couple dozen comments, maybe a few over 30 on a good day, by the same half dozen people repeating themselves with inserted subjects, I wonder how much attention a blog really gets.

    Do the eyes and minds of those researchers glaze and wander?

    “…the ultra-partisan will be briefly read but the more thoughtful comments will be looked at seriously for information and solutions to a problem.”

    I see much more of the former and suspect there might be a reason right there, why of all those people from around the globe; “not everyone wants to get involved.”

  28. HARRY LAWSON says:

    Harvey,

    Today I heard Vaghan Palmer suggest a public inquiry into many things including the ambulance service. Lol

    All the government has to do is listen,…… listen to the great posters we have on this blog , listen to the citizens , listen to the staff. Just listen.

    To think we have Dr Henry saying that the health authorities and others met to plan for the heat wave yet ambulance opens their emergency command centre when it cools down REALLY.

    MR Dix you have had 4 years to fix it .

    (Response: The government knew very well what was coming; Dr. Henry knew very well what was coming; the BC Ambulance brass knew very well what was coming … and yet, more than 700 British Columbians ended up dead … many after waiting desperately for hours while some ambulances sat idle, out of use … FOUR YEARS after the NDP pledged to fix the problem. Those are the facts: what is needed is not an inquiry …but ACTION and an APOLOGY from the Premier. h.o)

  29. e.a.f. says:

    Once upon a time, when writing letters to politicians was the only way to make your opinion known to them, it was considered for every letter they received there were approx. a thousand people out there with a similar point of view, hence letter writing campaigns. These days we have things like blogs, some of which are wonderfully researched, thoughtfully written, and bring about change.

    In B.C. we were lucky we had a number of excellent bloggers, unfortunately a number of them died. On the upside, we still have a number of excellent ones around. And just to stay on topic, one of the all news channels today was still running with the ambulance service story. That is a good thing, because, the politicians keep being reminded.

    Looking forward to Monday

  30. Stu de Baker says:

    Way, way off topic I now, but the current topic is about past it’s best before date and I know HO will be elated to hear this.

    The Serenade of the Seas, just completed a 4 day simulated return cruise from Seattle to Ketchikan and travelled through Canadian waters.

    Just for chuckles before tomorrow’s jalapeno topic.

    (Response: The feds wanted to intercept it …but I suspect none of our military ships were on the West coast … and none of our subs are seaworthy. 🙂 h.o)

  31. BMCQ says:

    It would be ridiculous and incredibly dangerous for Canada/B.C. to restrict Seattle/U.S. based Cruise Lines from our inside or any other Canadian waters on their voyage to Alaska .

    I have already pointed out that each and every day of the year there are upward of a hundred crossings of B.C. Ferries and other Canadian Ships and Boats travelling/navigating THROUGH U.S. Waters to travel to and from Tsawwassen, Swartz Bay and other Canadian Ports like Victoria/Swartz Bay.

    Please take a few minutes to review a map of the routes I describe, then report back and explain just how restricting U.S. based ships from our inside passage might work out .

    By now we all KNOW POTUS Biden is long past his “Best Before” date but even poor Joe would find some way to retaliate .

    He may even go far as demanding we purchase and hang Hunter Biden art work on our fleet of B.C. Ferries .

    None of the Canadian Military Fleet is operational at this time, many are not sea worthy and most of the Captains and Officers are gong through PC SJ Warrior re training, the PM promises that the much of the fleet will be fully operational and deployed sometime late 2032 .

  32. Stu de Baker says:

    BMCQ; “I have already pointed out that each and every day of the year there are upward of a hundred crossings of B.C. Ferries and other Canadian Ships and Boats travelling/navigating THROUGH U.S. Waters to travel to and from Tsawwassen, Swartz Bay and other Canadian Ports like Victoria/Swartz Bay.
    Please take a few minutes to review a map of the routes I describe, then report back and explain just how restricting U.S. based ships from our inside passage might work out .”

    That is such an enormous red herring, I shouldn’t even bother with a reply, but it is one of those social media moments where I see a manipulation of facts, coming from a source which believes no one else knows the difference.

    Dating back to 1951, there has been a “ferry specific” reciprocal agreement between the US and Canada for travel across the (Pacific) international boundary.

    The cruise ship Serenade of the Seas exercised its Right of innocent passage under the 1958 UN International Convention on the Law of the Sea.

    The ship travelled through Hecate Strait which is a Pacific Pilotage Authority non-compulsory area.

    Your uninformed response plus the previous misuse and misunderstanding of the legal term “technical stop” is what infuriated me in the prior blog on the cruise ship topic.

  33. BMCQ says:

    I have a very simple question for you .

    DO YOU honestly believe the U.S. Government would allow Canada to stop U.S. Ships and other Water Craft from travelling through the Inside Passage without retaliation ?

    Surely you are not that naive .

    The U.S. would react immediately if Canada was to restrict or halt U.S. Vessels from travelling through our Inside Passage, to think otherwise is silly .

    I know and understand you fancy yourself as a Maritime Expert but sometimes we need to understand that a Nation like the U.S. would not look kindly on Canada stopping the Inside Passage Traffic .

    Innocent Passage ? Yes, sure, whatever you say .

    The UN ? The UN has now been reduced to nothing but a daily grind of trying to determine what cuisine and champagne they will dine on each and every night, the UN now are stand for nothing and they are in turn considered nothing .

    There is a big difference between claiming expertise and then facing the reality of a country like the U.S. if they feel they have been wronged .

    For one thin g you might want to consider that over 70% of Canadian manufactured product is sold/shipped to the U.S., please provide your plan to replace that if Canada attempts to halt U.S. Vessels from navigating our Inside Passage .

    FYI – I do not recall making any comment on the Technical Stop, but go ahead, show me where I did that .

    I suggest you stand back and watch and then see what happens if Canada halts that traffic, then wait a month and get back to me .

    Can you tell us that if the U.S. Senate decided to pass legislation that changed the whole structure of the current agreement as they have with the Cruise Ships based and travelling from Seattle an agreement such as the one you point out would deter the U.S. from restricting Canadian Water Craft from navigating U.S. waters between the mainland and Victoria ?

    Why don’t you send an e mail to the Canadian PM pointing out your expertise on this manner, tell him you are well informed and you can be “Point Man’ on this, I am sure he would jump at the chance for you to bring home the Glory for Canada .

    I know you would show those Americans who is boss, I have faith in you .

    Funny .

    (Response: This is a perfect example of a problem I face with my blog: Stu makes a very brief off topic “just for chuckles” observation of something in the news that just happened and relates to a previous topic … I allow it … and then OFF WE GO …a whole debate is launched, regurgitating arguments from the previous post on the topic when it was up for discussion …and totally OFF the current posted topic. Probably much to Horgan’s delight! Geez! I’ll give you the last word … but END the totally OFF TOPIC discussion here. h.o)

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